cRPG
cRPG => Ban/Unban Requests => Closed Requests => Topic started by: Vicious666 on April 14, 2011, 11:48:21 pm
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I now i am vicious etc
but really i was 1 round afk becouse i alt tabbed and was talking on ts with some friend i was giving them youtube links, but since i am vicious i am always watched. so bam first time i go afk 1 round , i get banished. i totally forgot that i spawned on crpg while i was talking.
i was getting kills every round (is all in log admin can check the map where i was banned and all the previous ) , i was simply distracted by what i was doing on ts, it can happen even to me. but thx to my past a single moment become a motivation for ban me.
i am very accurate to avoid kick and bans, and after wooki bans (ban from forum with no rules and no evidence , and he got also removed as admin just 2 week after.. ) so i play regular, charge yes, but also fighting and getting kills.
just becouse its me not means that if i am afk 1 round i am leeching
and just becouse i am barely 1:1 or in negative that not means i am leeching, every body know that when i play i do 20:5 30:5+ but i cant play all day focused 100%, sometimes i simply dress cheap charge get some kills and die, becouse i wanna xp but i have no more the stamina to play at my top. and i not think is against the rules
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It's true i distracted him with this kpop video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKY4p2WRx4s
If you don't know we're often in a channel in the wolves ts (vicious, chrystthemperor and me)
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As I was a witness on this specific situation, I have the "a priori" right to stand up and speak.
I was playing with some other mercs (Gresin, Vicious, etc) on that server, when the occurrence took place. We had been for a while on teamspeak while playing, as any other normal day in mercs life, and suddenly out of nowhere we see the system message of the ban. I was surprised, obviously, then I alt tabbed to see if he had by any chance lost connection or something, and noticed that he warned he was going to another TS server for some reason I ignored at that time.
Seems now it was Wolves server (friendly folks), and he got insta-banned from the game server for a "away from keyboard" explained by him already, where at least, I saw no warning on the action.
I find this anti-Merc vendetta reaching unpleasant levels of lack of respect and sportsmanship by either overall game population as (unacceptably) by certain game administrators.
It's urgent a reform of the current administration listings, and the acceptance of respectful and mature persons into the staff, persons such as Kinngrimm from the Wolves clan, that wouldn't ever bypass Rules due to personal issues. I understand that chadz accept people into the staff that are actually developers or helpers in the game maintenance, but seems it's not enough.
Without further issue, and with best regards,
kold.
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I thought Vicious was admin already? ffs people, hurry up and give him the admin password.
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As I was a witness on this specific situation, I have the "a priori" right to stand up and speak.
I was playing with some other mercs (Gresin, Vicious, etc) on that server, when the occurrence took place. We had been for a while on teamspeak while playing, as any other normal day in mercs life, and suddenly out of nowhere we see the system message of the ban. I was surprised, obviously, then I alt tabbed to see if he had by any chance lost connection or something, and noticed that he warned he was going to another TS server for some reason I ignored at that time.
Seems now it was Wolves server (friendly folks), and he got insta-banned from the game server for a "away from keyboard" explained by him already, where at least, I saw no warning on the action.
I find this anti-Merc vendetta reaching unpleasant levels of lack of respect and sportsmanship by either overall game population as (unacceptably) by certain game administrators.
It's urgent a reform of the current administration listings, and the acceptance of respectful and mature persons into the staff, persons such as Kinngrimm from the Wolves clan, that wouldn't ever bypass Rules due to personal issues. I understand that chadz accept people into the staff that are actually developers or helpers in the game maintenance, but seems it's not enough.
Without further issue, and with best regards,
kold.
i not think okin did it in a malicious way, i am simply watched. so even if this time happened all becouse i made a normal alt tab for a round, cause my past, it is judged and considered in a more serious way than it should be, but i find quite interesting that lilith was sending me a pm asking me if i was playng another game, tryng to make me say that i was playng another game for then promptly use that pm against me. (nice trap try Lilith) (i joined irc, and he was "again by casuality" talking against me on my back )
i not get also why lilith wanna be involved in a question he is not involved at all
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You know, I was on IRC at that time... they discussed about 10minutes if they should finally permaban you, so please don't start spouting nonsense. I don't have a screen for the logs (you're not that important, why should I screen it), but they watched you, cause you seemed to be on borderline leeching (again). Peasant gear, no effort, and worst of all: On start of every round you autowalked into a wall, kept doing it for about 10secs, got into game, chambered your weapon into slash and walked into the middle of enemypuddles to be killed. Shik reported a 0:5 score on the last map before, you apparently been doing the same as when you were watched minutes later.
Okin was rather reluctant to ban you, even asked cmpx, who gave his "+1".
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Yeah, to make it very clear, you weren't banned for a few seconds of idling, but for several rounds of "active leeching". I only saw him charge with chamber once, though, on the other rounds he spammed in every direction while running at the group, and happened to get a few kills, because that's what happens. Still, it was pretty clear that he wasn't really interested in anything other than dying as quickly as possible, and that's what made it a leeching ban.
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Edit: post I was responding to is gone, removed as spam apparently. I guess I'll reply to this one instead:
I was playing with some other mercs (Gresin, Vicious, etc) on that server, when the occurrence took place. We had been for a while on teamspeak while playing, as any other normal day in mercs life, and suddenly out of nowhere we see the system message of the ban.
I immediately followed the ban up with an admin line saying he was banned for leeching on devs' orders, but I guess you weren't there to see it. Other players had already been complaining about him in earlier rounds, though, and weren't really sad to see him go.
Seems now it was Wolves server (friendly folks), and he got insta-banned from the game server for a "away from keyboard" explained by him already, where at least, I saw no warning on the action.
Dunno about Wolves, it was on EU1. I specifically asked the others if I should give him a warning first, but I was told not to bother since he had been kicked, banned and warned for leeching so many times already. I was very careful and watched him for a long time (over fifteen minutes, in fact), because this seemed to me like a grey area case, and punishments for repeat offenders can be harsh.
I find this anti-Merc vendetta reaching unpleasant levels of lack of respect and sportsmanship by either overall game population as (unacceptably) by certain game administrators.
Well, I certainly haven't got an anti-Merc vendetta, and I've seen that even many Mercs don't agree with Vicious' way of playing.
I had a long talk with Vicious last night, and everything he said will be taken into account. We'll see what comes of it.
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Okay, we've talked it through and a decision has been reached.
Leeching is bad. Nobody with any kind of sense in their head can dispute that, and it's forbidden in the official rules.
How do you define leeching? That's less clear. But because admins are here to enforce the rules, the burden of making the decisions falls on them. There can never be a one-size-fits-all rule that clearly defines all cases, it will always come down to an individual admin making the call based on the particulars of a specific case. We'll do our best to standardize procedure, but it'll never be perfect, because that's how people work and there will always be new kinds of situations to deal with. Bottom line is that somebody has to draw the line somewhere, and that somebody is us. You don't have to like it (we certainly don't), but that's what chadz has specifically told us to do. Deciding when to kick, when to ban and when to warn is part of the same package.
Vicious, since it seems there was a reasonable possibility that you really didn't realize what you were doing was leeching in the eyes of admins, we're letting you off the hook, but you have to understand that this really is your last chance. It's up to you to decide how to play the game, it's not possible for us to tell you that. Lots of people play with crap gear to make more gold, and that's their call. However, you need to really understand that if you ever find yourself doing anything that any admin might decide is leeching, you're taking a risk. Now, that applies to everybody, but I'm specifically saying it to Vicious because he's really managed to wear out the collective patience of the admins over the past months, which I think he knows by now. You can only be banned for the same thing so many times, and chadz himself said that after the next one, you'll never be able to play cRPG again.
Like I said, decisions are case-by-case. Sometimes leeching is totally obvious, sometimes it's less so. However, even getting a few kills every now and then isn't enough if anybody can tell just by looking at you that you're not really trying to play the game at all, and are only interested in dying as quickly as possible. If you're genuinely not interested in playing properly, as a real member of the team, then you shouldn't be on the server. Being reckless isn't disallowed -- hell, a lot of people would call my playing reckless a lot of the time. But I've never had a death wish, and neither should anybody else. Risk-taking isn't the same as suiciding, so if you're playing, play to win, not to die; anything less essentially means you're deliberately hurting your team's performance, and that's not cool.
I've done my best to explain what this is all about. Maybe it's not good enough, but for now, it'll have to do. In the end it comes down to common sense, and the problem with that is obvious: a given player's idea of it may not be the same as a given admin's. However, the admins have to decide what's what, and everyone has to live with those decisions. If you don't want to have to worry, then try to make sure there's no room for doubt. If that doesn't seem fair, then it's too bad, but nobody's perfect.
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Why are you writing his essay?
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It's not his, I'm writing an essay on behalf of all the admins so we don't get banned by this nasty community. ;(
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Concerning posts that were removed:
http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php/topic,1492.45.html (http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php/topic,1492.45.html)
It's an unban thread, not a floor for public debate, or even giving opinions on the proceedings. Admins have been pretty serious about this rule.
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ok thx I understand completely what you mean., and i am happy that this time instead considering my past you analized the case as what it was, not a leeching case.
ill try my best for not put myself into ambiguous scenario again
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ok thx I understand completely what you mean., and i am happy that this time instead considering my past you analized the case as what it was, not a leeching case.
ill try my best for not put myself into ambiguous scenario again
I'm sorry, but I'm not sure you do. It was a leeching case, that's why you were banned in the first place. We only let you off because we decided that you probably hadn't been doing it deliberately, since you didn't realize there was a problem. Maybe that's what you meant, but I'm just making sure, since you need to understand that this wasn't just about the AFKing and autorunning, but the repeated, deliberate suiciding by charging enemy mob to die ASAP. That is leeching. So if you're going to go right back to doing that, then we might as well ban you now and save everybody some trouble and heartbreak. :P
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I'm sorry, but I'm not sure you do. It was a leeching case, that's why you were banned in the first place. We only let you off because we decided that you probably hadn't been doing it deliberately, since you didn't realize there was a problem. Maybe that's what you meant, but I'm just making sure, since you need to understand that this wasn't just about the AFKing and autorunning, but the repeated, deliberate suiciding by charging enemy mob to die ASAP. That is leeching. So if you're going to go right back to doing that, then we might as well ban you now and save everybody some trouble and heartbreak. :P
no i got that this for you is leeching. but.
for me is not. so for me not was a case of leeching, now that i now you consider that leeching i will not do that, still i think not was leeching. becouse leech by definition means do nothing, and charging fighting getting kills is not leeching, sure is a method for play less possible, but is a game feature not an exploit and you cant distinguish a noob who die from a player who do that on purpose and even if you do, cant be considered leeching, becouse is actively playng. so unless you make a rule that forbidden the player to play unless he play at 100%, or that he cant die in first minute otherwise be considered leeching, or this value only if you are a good player?
from my point of view, you enforce me to condivide your point of view. (and many admin cover theyr opinion with the sentence "common sense" )
not a writed rule. and i consider that ambiguous , is also a very hard situation to judge, how you will distinguish on future if i have only a bad momentum? or i am charging ? since i charge a lot and all player in this mod know that i am always charging even when i play at 100% .
In my case is also more easyer to judge if am deliberating playng "easy for die faster" since i am a good player, but how you will judge a noob player? from what i see on server, the admin not notice at all bad player charging , becouse they are not know good player, so seams doesnt matter if they are "leeching" by your definition since they not have many gen and are not good, so even if they play 100% they not make difference, so why ban them ? they not make the difference. sometimes i think that all this admin playng also, cause a conflict of interest when they need to apply the rules, expecial considering that many of them are on rival clans of merc .
so i get 100% what you mean, but dont make me say is a rule, becouse is admin personal opinion., and every time will happens to someone something similar that happened to me, you will not apply a rule, you will apply what you call common sense, that in truth, will be the admin personal opinion and judgment of the situation, hardly an uncontestable method to analyze the fact.
ps: look how many views got a vicious unban thread 600+ where all other "normal" player get 100 , just for say how this "rule" can be applyed differently, if is an unknown player or a know good player , becouse sometimes i see there is some "interest" on get the ban hammer on certain player at all cost.
so in the end my request is do your best for define better such situation/rule, removing from admins the weight of a personals interpretations of the cases.
my 2 cents