cRPG

cRPG => General Discussion => Topic started by: Lt_Anders on January 06, 2011, 01:53:10 am

Title: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Lt_Anders on January 06, 2011, 01:53:10 am
What are the benefits of playing siege. From the looks of it, it looks like the attackers get massive gold, but defenders don't have equipment breaking.

Is this true, or is it something else?
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Varyag on January 06, 2011, 02:21:00 am
This is so wrong.

1) defenders also have upkeep.
2) The longer it takes to capture the flag for attackers, the more xp/gold they have. Which is very strange...to say the least. Hopefully it will be fixed.
3) Every round I played siege, defenders lose. Which means attackers dont have upkeep. Hopefully it will be somehow fixed.
4) Playing as defender currently means loosing ur multiplier and having upkeep.  It is a sort of penalty.
Title: Re: Siege Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Seranoth on January 06, 2011, 02:56:43 am
after playing 2 hours on crpg 6 siegeserver i only can say this money/exp system isn't just the right gainsystem for siege mode. Before 0.200 the gamegoal was clear- defenders got more money when they could hold the castle a long time, and the attackers must rush the castle as fast as possible to win more gold as the defenders at end of round. That the attackers mostly got the flag wasn't fatal, because the defenders got their money even through.

 Iam normally a very frugal person, but this new gainsystem is very unsuitable and unnecessary. The attackers still always win and get more and more money when the player have the luck to not get teambalanced - plus-  the attackers get more money when they stall the round. The defenders have no chance to get a higher multiplier for the whole time of the round with leeching attackers. Thats not just unfair- its witless. The Maingoal is now just goldfarming by leeching. Such a system makes no fun anymore.

I want the old system back. point.


btw- sry my english is still not the best :P
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Ishar on January 06, 2011, 03:03:39 am
I am destined to spam this forever, at every siege-related topic:
Siege balance thread (http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php/topic,320.0.html)

My take on the matter, summed up:

Quote
-Unlimited lives for defenders (timer will decide the siege anyway)
-Less respawn time, and while we're at it:
-Slower flag cap (it's over way too fast)
-Less round time (around 8 minutes would be still hard to hold, but not impossible)
-Some kind of ladder limit (or just increase their price tenfold: people would bring less ladders because of the upkeep)
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Lt_Anders on January 06, 2011, 03:05:26 am
Quote from: Varyag on January 06, 2011, 02:21:00 am
This is so wrong.

1) defenders also have upkeep.
2) The longer it takes to capture the flag for attackers, the more xp/gold they have. Which is very strange...to say the least. Hopefully it will be fixed.
3) Every round I played siege, defenders lose. Which means attackers dont have upkeep. Hopefully it will be somehow fixed.
4) Playing as defender currently means loosing ur multiplier and having upkeep.  It is a sort of penalty.

after playing some, this is the case. Defenders will ALWAYS have upkeep due to the loss and not have a round bonus.

Siege needs to change. I lost 3k gold because my character was ALWAYS defender, and if he wasn't, he'd be teamswitched over.
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Blondin on January 06, 2011, 03:28:06 am
Maybe we can switch at each round (and each map), we will win less (x2 max) but it will be fair.
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: XavierX on January 06, 2011, 04:12:53 am
Quote from: Blondin on January 06, 2011, 03:28:06 am
Maybe we can switch at each round (and each map), we will win less (x2 max) but it will be fair.

This. Teams should switch sides once they defend or attack.
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Helrekkr on January 06, 2011, 08:35:55 am
If you have the teams switch sides now all you get is a perpetual x1 -> x2 -> x1 for everybody playing siege :P

Also as others have mentioned, the current system rewards attackers for taking LONGER to win which is  :mrgreen:

It clearly needs a lot of work, though I would like to comment on:

Quote from: Ishar
-Unlimited lives for defenders (timer will decide the siege anyway)
-Less respawn time, and while we're at it:
-Slower flag cap (it's over way too fast)
-Less round time (around 8 minutes would be still hard to hold, but not impossible)
-Some kind of ladder limit (or just increase their price tenfold: people would bring less ladders because of the upkeep)

I agree changes are needed but if all those were to be implemented I'm pretty sure attackers would go from a 99% win rate to something like 10%.
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Gristle on January 06, 2011, 08:37:27 am
I haven't been able to join Siege since the patch.

Are the Siege servers still doing 12 minute rounds? Of course it's impossible to defend that long. That was fine with the old system, but currently anything over 6 minutes just isn't fair. Do Defenders still have limited lives? this has to go, too.
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Casimir on January 06, 2011, 09:49:27 am
Seige is fine. You take cheaper equipment when defending and work together. When attacking take your best stuff and try and break the lines of defence. I implore chadz not to change seige and for the people to see sence.
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: audax on January 06, 2011, 10:15:27 am
Quote from: Casimir on January 06, 2011, 09:49:27 am
Seige is fine. You take cheaper equipment when defending and work together. When attacking take your best stuff and try and break the lines of defence. I implore chadz not to change seige and for the people to see sence.
So you actually defended succesfully?
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Ishar on January 06, 2011, 11:20:29 am
Quote from: Helrekkr on January 06, 2011, 08:35:55 am
I agree changes are needed but if all those were to be implemented I'm pretty sure attackers would go from a 99% win rate to something like 10%.

You misunderstand me, I'm not saying all of these should be there, these are just possibilities of balancing. These were the easiest I could think of.

Yes, you can use the autobalance, switch teams, play along with the multiplier, but that just adjusts the exp/gold income for a broken system. Why not repair the thing instead?
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Takoul on January 06, 2011, 01:38:07 pm
Well i played siege last night on EU 6 for about 8 hours and managed to gain some good insights into how the patch affected things.
Unfortunately, due to my alcohol intake over said period, it all became a bit hazy. A bit like there was a blue fog in my brain as well as on the map :p

I was surprised how quickly my money went up over the whole session compared to pre patch. Ok I wasn't wearing the best gear (having recently retired plus the character rollback, I had to level a bit)
But you know, with just a padded jack, nasal helm, leather boots, mail gauntlets, sarranid guard sword and 12 franciscas I STILL had fun.
Less archers meant less 1-hit-1-kills on me. And with the fog I was able to get to the action a whole lot more easily.
I just don't subscribe to 'if it ain't plate it ain't worth it'. I had to develop my personal combat skills on the battlefield more. Even not having a shield didn't ruin my fun. I just made myself a harder target (weaving like a drunken thing, that may have been the wine though). And now my blocking skills have improved enough to make people think twice after i block a couple of their swings. They saw i was a hard target to kill and decided to go after someone else. Very noticeable that.

Like i mentioned in game, spend  few sessions in light armour, hoard your cash, then next few sessions don your better gear and raise hell amongst the enemy. OR have two sets of armour, and switch in game to minimise repair costs.
A worn francisca axe in the face looked to hurt as much as as one that was repaired.

The only thing that in my opinion that needs fixing in siege is the multiplier. PLEASE tie it in to the timer:
The attackers should start with a x5 and defenders x1. halfway through the 12mins both teams should be on x3. And at the end, if the defenders have done well (2mins left on clock) the multiplier should be x1 for attackers and x5 for defenders.
This brings back the incentive to cap/defend the flag. As it is we had attackers standing near the flag waiting for the timer to go down before capping, and the battles lost their siege-like nature.

SO if the defenders hold out a long time, they would get more gp to repair with.
AND i think if the attackers cap quickly (meaning the defenders only get a x1 exp/gp tick) there should be a reduced chance of items breaking. Otherwise, several quick caps would mean, as a defender, hideous repair costs, and people drifitng away from siege servers.

It wasn't disastrous that there was a quick cap though. Quick caps just meant the next round came quicker, the exp and gps ticks came around again quicker. The only downside was if you had a x5 mltiplier and your team capped in the 1st minute.

Overall I seemed to have enough time on the attacking team after auto 'balance', to gather some gold to offset repairs.
Some good ideas in this patch, justs needs a bit of tweaking.
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Casimir on January 06, 2011, 01:47:56 pm
Successful defences have always been rare and tequire either smart defenders or stacked teams. Playing 3 roundd on seige each time the defenders got close to 1 min.

This wasnt a particularly coordinated or successful team yet we were close to victory.

Seige is fine
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Jason on January 06, 2011, 03:46:31 pm
when you play for 5 hours straight and there is not 1 successful defense its broken. Especially when the defending team had more kills than the attackers.  Maybe a fix could be making the 30 second spawn down to 20 second spawn.  Is 5 lives vs unlimited lives really fair?
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Ishar on January 06, 2011, 05:22:55 pm
Quote from: Casimir on January 06, 2011, 01:47:56 pm
Successful defences have always been rare and tequire either smart defenders or stacked teams. Playing 3 roundd on seige each time the defenders got close to 1 min.

This wasnt a particularly coordinated or successful team yet we were close to victory.

Seige is fine

Almost winning is still losing with the current system.
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Casimir on January 06, 2011, 05:28:38 pm
Yes but it is possible to win IF people work together, there are just very few coordinated people in c-rpg

But yeah i agree but no radical changes are needed just maybe shorten the time a bit or reduced the respawn delay.
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Ishar on January 06, 2011, 08:38:09 pm
The deed is done, siege became cool again.
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: FRANK_THE_TANK on May 18, 2014, 01:52:56 pm
No need to worry Anders. NA siege is gone, dead, a thing of the distant past.

:3
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: SP1N on May 18, 2014, 03:37:30 pm
frank pls
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Austrian on May 18, 2014, 03:40:27 pm
Day of necro-bumps today?
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Molly on May 18, 2014, 03:46:09 pm
Only reason Austri posted in here is because he gets hammered on EU1 early on and is bored by waiting all the time :D

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: Kafein on May 18, 2014, 04:46:09 pm
I was about to go on a minusing spree then I noticed this

visitors can't see pics , please register or login
Title: Re: Seige Mode: How is it better?
Post by: FRANK_THE_TANK on May 19, 2014, 02:25:25 am
I say everybody +s shitgrins posts, all of them. Let's install a new king!

374 post if all the people that have replied head out there into the tubes and + all his poop. Well, a king we shall!

----

EDIT

It appears he really liked posting in the spam section... we may need a bigger boat.