cRPG
cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Game Balance Discussion => Topic started by: Black Wind on May 20, 2012, 05:24:39 pm
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Hello,
I know that none of you equestrian lovers will like this idea, but how bout this.
Everyone knows that lancing is OP. Deep down the lancers know it too, and just roll that class so their E-penis' can expand, "ZoMgGGG Got like 8 kills that round".
I think, that lances should only last so-long each round. e.g. 50% chance that it'll "break" for the round, and can't be used anymore. I'm not saying that it "breaks" and will require upkeep, but just so that my old friendgy lancers can't run around killing anything/everything the moment they aren't looking or are in combat.
/gets the flame extinguisher
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another qq thread
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another qq thread
Not really, there's no cav in AU anyway. Just seems OP when I chill in NA.
Besides, I'm a PK, cav run for cover from me, because I can kill lancers with my +3 English Bill, glaive, GLA, German Poleaxe etc.
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get the sand out of your vagina and man up.
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Just seems OP when I chill in NA.
Besides, I'm a PK, cav run for cover from me
What do you want besides trolling?
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PK's goal is to improve the game through application of expertise, specific knowledge and proven concepts. Breaking lances work in other mods and could work well in c-RPG.
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son of odin loves that quote and so do I :D
But yeah, I was thinking something like 3 couches and it breaks or you have a % chance of dropping it. So you slam into some one kill them and it flies out of your hand.
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I`m ok with this idead but also..
Fix 2h animations
Remove the polestuns
Make all shields break after X amount of hits
Increase the weight penalty for archers
And add power draw for Xbows aswell.
Do that and im fine with breaking lances. :twisted:
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And buff swashbucklers, obviously.
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PD for Xbows AND polear / 2hstab animation.
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Make all shields break after X amount of hits
And add power draw for Xbows aswell.
I'm fine with the others, but elaborate with the make all shields breaker after x amount of hits, unless you have 13 skill, they all break in some amount of hits.
PD equivalence for Xbows I'm rather hesitant about, it would be an interesting change. They might hit harder, but it also might reduce the number of xbowers and that'll make me happy.
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X-bow is already a substantial disadvantage.
On topic the problem with shattering lances is that often couched attacks do tremendous damage I got 800 damage once in native. The higher your riding skill and the faster your horse the quicker your lance will break. Great lances should take a lot more damage jousting lances a lot less.
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Cav's just mad that it'll remove their ability to get 9:1 kdr in one round by lancing people who're already in combat. Even a thrust drops people in one hit, when well placed.
No skills required, don't believe me? Just watch a de-horsed HeavenHill of Crafty attempt to block. Despite his ability to top the board as cav...
Learn to accept it, it's OP.
Inb4 shitstorm
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Every class has strengths and weaknesses. Cavalry has lots of weaknesses on top of it's obvious strengths. Nothing is overpowered when it has weaknesses and classes that easily counter it. The heavy lance is out reached (well if the infantry aims for horses head) by lots of 2h swords. Not to mention aware infantry can just easily side step everything but a +3 arabian, and the decent players side step and then swing their 10 foot long Conan-sword and kill the rider.
Cavalry is actually doing what they are supposed to be doing when they engage enemy infantry who are already engaged with their teammates.
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if cav is so afraid of pk then why are you complaining. :lol:
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e.g. 50% chance that it'll "break" for the round, and can't be used anymore
My lance is my main weapon when i am on foot, so no. If this was added makes all weapons breaks too, to make it more realistic
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My lance is my main weapon when i am on foot, so no. If this was added makes all weapons breaks too, to make it more realistic
Well if lance has 50% chance of breaking ingame it should not have any repair costs. Since obviously making a new weak wooden shaft which breaks more than anything else is so easy that every warrior can do it by themselves and professional weaponsmith is not required.
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if cav is so afraid of pk then why are you complaining. :lol:
It's not a complaint, mere rookie. It's a general observation from the perspective of a superior player,
When I'm on the server NA_cRPG_1 all I see is QQ. So I decided it's time for a real elitist to step in and demand change to balance gameplay for the typical player.
Cavalry, personally are a joke. They pose about as much threat as a gummy worn would.
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Omg after that stupid angle limitation on horseback are people still complaining that lancing is OP? What do you still want to take away, our hit points may be?
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It's a complaint, yes my friend. It's a general observation from the perspective of a player who has his head up in his arse,
When I'm on the server NA_cRPG_1 all I do is QQ. So I decided it's time for a real elitist cunt to step in and demand change to balance gameplay according to his biased views on things he doesn't know shit about.
fix'd that for ya ^^
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fix'd that for ya ^^
You're just biased towards opposing PK, because in comparison to our amazing ability, you look like an aborted foetus with spina bifida.
EDIT: I've spent 4 gens as cav, and I could garuntee you, I'd beat you on every plane of Mount & Combat. This is because, I, am the best in the world.
Even the lowliest PK member would completely take you back to school, and set you on square one. In comparison to PK, you make people suffering down-syndrome look normal. You are the pinnacle of disabled on warband, no doubt because like all other EU and NA scum, you can't block.
(inb4 "I can block pro, u just dnt see cuz u nvr on my server") Bitch, I've been on NA and EU long enough to see how sub-par the skill-level is on a median field in comparison to the lifestyle, the globe refers to as the "Strength of the South". (If you haven't heard of PK in the news yet, get off the computer chair and get outdoors).
I can bet you, you're as retarded as Bjord was when I saw him in NA. So stop talking shit on the forums, unless you can actually back him up (Which I doubt immensely, considering you lost -every- match against Shogunate. Fallen is nothing. We would fuck you guys up, even with 240 ping.
PK is a lifestyle, not a mere everyday clan.
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You're just right towards opposing PK, because in comparison to your amazing ability, PK looks like an aborted foetus with spina bifida.
fix'd that for you again ^^
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fix'd that for you again ^^
Read edit
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Read edit. It's full of shit
Fix'd that for ya again ^^
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I can bet you, you're as retarded as Bjord was when I saw him in NA. So stop talking shit on the forums, unless you can actually back him up (Which I doubt immensely, considering you lost -every- match against Shogunate. Fallen is nothing. We would fuck you guys up, even with 240 ping.
Well this is an amusing thing to wander into before vanishing for a few days.
As Fallen Leadership: Challenge accepted. Please find a few times acceptable for a Clan skirmish and we will organize the details such as X is allowed or X members etc.
Thank you for your time, please step up to the plate. Go ahead and post in our clan thread what you would like.
We could use another scrim to get rid of the rust, and for other reasons.
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Fix'd that for ya again ^^
Whatever helps you sleep at night.
Anyway, it's 3:32am in VIC, AUS. I'll continue educating thee Ynoobs tomorrow.
And Tears of Dick, may I enquire as to the international timezone difference so I can decide upon a reasonable time for both parties?
I'll scrim on two conditions, melee only? Because we all know that a retard eating a lollipop can hold left click & aim.
Secondly, as long as it doesn't interrupt my studies of tertiary education.
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Well this is an amusing thing to wander into before vanishing for a few days.
As Fallen Leadership: Challenge accepted. Please find a few times acceptable for a Clan skirmish and we will organize the details such as X is allowed or X members etc.
Thank you for your time, please step up to the plate. Go ahead and post in our clan thread what you would like.
We could use another scrim to get rid of the rust, and for other reasons.
Well I'm afraid it is not possible since PK is only one guy who uses many accounts to troll around forums apparently :D. Oh wait.
And Tears of Destiny, may I enquire as to the international timezone difference so we can decide upon a reasonable time for both parties?
I'll scrim on one condition, melee only? Because we all know that a retard eating a lollipop can write stupid shit in forums.
I have to correct you all the time. Your wiring is messed up inside your head? Finding a reasonable time for both might be difficult because Fallen is NA/EU clan. But sure we will be there.
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And Tears of Destiny, may I enquire as to the international timezone difference so I can decide upon a reasonable time for both parties?
I'll scrim on one condition, melee only? Because we all know that a retard eating a lollipop can hold left click & aim.
Melee only? Interesting reasons, with that logic everyone should be a Jambi or a DaveUKR *shrugs*
Well, seeing as you mainly are yelling at the EU folks, you should probably scrim with them. They have the most Melee anyways. NA has a lot of dirty rotten archers and cav.
Timezones are:
EU would be mostly UTC+0 and UTC+1
NA would be UTC-8/7/6/5
http://www.worldtimezone.com/
Regardless of outcomes, this should be a fun skrim.
EDIT: Also curious if you want armor restrictions.
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So what aboot cavalry? Is it not allowed as you say melee only, and because "we all know that a retard eating a lollipop can hold left click and release or press x while riding"?
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My lance is my main weapon when i am on foot, so no. If this was added makes all weapons breaks too, to make it more realistic
That would be unrealistic, a metal sword will not break after 5-6 minutes of fighting, while a wooden shaft can break if you ram it into a shield/armor while standing on a horse.
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Melee only? Interesting reasons, with that logic everyone should be a Jambi or a DaveUKR *shrugs*
Well, seeing as you mainly are yelling at the EU folks, you should probably scrim with them. They have the most Melee anyways. NA has a lot of dirty rotten archers and cav.
Timezones are:
EU would be mostly UTC+0 and UTC+1
NA would be UTC-8/7/6/5
http://www.worldtimezone.com/
Regardless of outcomes, this should be a fun skrim.
EDIT: Also curious if you want armor restrictions.
Just putting it out there, have you ever tried blocking with 380 ping? (Or shooting, because you're an archer?)
Sounds like a brilliant idea!
That would be unrealistic, a metal sword will not break after 5-6 minutes of fighting, while a wooden shaft can break if you ram it into a shield/armor while standing on a horse.
And in a sense of realism, if you lance through a tincan, how would one retrieve that lance once he's impaled, and you're riding past?
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Just putting it out there, have you ever tried blocking with 380 ping? (Or shooting, because you're an archer?)
Sounds like a brilliant idea!
Well you disqualified the majority of my NA players, so that too was a brilliant idea.
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Well you disqualified the majority of my NA players, so that too was a brilliant idea.
Well, I'm not sure if you've heard, but we have a sponsor for PK's NA tour next year. Better get the umbrella out, because there's a storm coming.
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this thread derailed a little into just PK and Fallen bad mouthing each other... personally cav's fine. go bother ranged some more and leave us horsemen alone.
BTW is this PK guy serious or just trolling, cause no ones honestly that thick headed right?
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Lancing is the premium anti-tincan weapon. As such, it must be damaging against everyone else as well.
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this thread derailed a little into just PK and Fallen bad mouthing each other... personally cav's fine. go bother ranged some more and leave us horsemen alone.
BTW is this PK guy serious or just trolling, cause no ones honestly that thick headed right?
What is there to derail when the original post is biased and retarded QQ- post from a guy who obviously is butt hurt about cavalry and archery? He has a big mouth but he can't give any proper arguments backing his sayings other than the brag about him and his butt buddies being the best in the world and knowing everything. They can't even troll properly if this is what it is all aboot. It's only stupid...
Blah...
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Gee, Odin,
I really thought you would just be quiet and accept that PK is superior to every other clan out there. You're more worthless than a skidmark on my PK signed underpants. You always seem just to go against whatever I say, regardless of how good the idea is, purely, because I declined your application to start a EU branch of PK. I mean, sorry, you don't cut the criteria of being a boss. Get over it. Fuck.
And "leave us horsemen alone" why? everyone whinges about it, and how isn't it OP? You can couch like, how many people in one round? Yeah, too many. You're just an ignorant rookie who can't see the light that PK brings with our more than reasonable suggestion. Talk about biased. So, grow a set, and learn to melee.
In NA I noticed a guy called HeavenHill_of_Crafty who often tops the killboard as cav with a charger. I saw him once his horse died, and he couldn't even block at all. #soskilled.
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Gee, Odin,
I really thought you would just be quiet and accept that PK is superior to every other clan out there. You're more worthless than a skidmark on my PK signed underpants.
visitors can't see pics , please register or login
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Gee, Odin,
I really thought you would just be quiet and accept that PK is superior to every other clan out there. You're more worthless than a skidmark on my PK signed underpants. You always seem just to go against whatever I say, regardless of how good the idea is, purely, because I declined your application to start a EU branch of PK. I mean, sorry, you don't cut the criteria of being a boss. Get over it. Fuck.
And "leave us horsemen alone" why? everyone whinges about it, and how isn't it OP? You can couch like, how many people in one round? Yeah, too many. You're just an ignorant rookie who can't see the light that PK brings with our more than reasonable suggestion. Talk about biased. So, grow a set, and learn to melee.
In NA I noticed a guy called HeavenHill_of_Crafty who often tops the killboard as cav with a charger. I saw him once his horse died, and he couldn't even block at all. #soskilled.
Quoted in case you want to edit your posts once again. I have never ever wanted to have anything to do with you dirtbags. I'm using a cavalry hybrid build because I like playing in melee too. I'm not going to brag about my skills or no skills. I do my part in melee or cav and that's that. Unlike you melee "elitists" like to think, there is other classes to play and all of them require completely different skillset and tactics. I don't go against everything you say because it's you posting it. It's just because most of the time you just post ignorant shit. So grow a set, and learn to cav or shoot.
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son of odin loves that quote and so do I :D
But yeah, I was thinking something like 3 couches and it breaks or you have a % chance of dropping it. So you slam into some one kill them and it flies out of your hand.
I wouldn't mind at all a limit for the number of couching (except for the "counching only" weapons of course). Not that it would break your lance, but just you can't do it anymore, so back to using it normally.
That's actually pretty interesting, and i'd be ready to give it a try.
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Quoted in case you want to edit your posts once again. I have never ever wanted to have anything to do with you dirtbags. I'm using a cavalry hybrid build because I like playing in melee too. I'm not going to brag about my skills or no skills. I do my part in melee or cav and that's that. Unlike you melee "elitists" like to think, there is other classes to play and all of them require completely different skillset and tactics. I don't go against everything you say because it's you posting it. It's just because most of the time you just post ignorant shit. So grow a set, and learn to cav or shoot.
Many flaws there.
1. Ok, you didn't ask to create a PK sub-branch in EU servers.
2. Us melee 'elitists' believe that melee is the only way to play, because it requires the most skill. There's no blocking associated with 'shooting' or 'cav'.
3. I did cav for 3 gens, and thus, am quite adequate at it.
4. I find it ironic that you suggest I roll into "shooting" and "cav", and that I need to grow a set. Those classes are the text-book definition of vagina.
5. Yes, you do go against everything I say, or any other PK's, because it's us.
6. Be realistic, if you couch anyone, with one of those twig-like lances (not great or jousting) would you expect it not to break, considering a tincan would typically weigh ~100kg+, and those lances are pin-dick thin, hitting them at say, 40km/h? At the very least, it'd go through them, resulting in the splintering or loss of the lance.
Get your head on straight! Oh wait, what head? All you EUmy old friends and NAmy old friends just conform like sheep to what one semi-respected player suggests.
Now, here's some reasons why my observation is more valid than yours;
1. I was a dedicated cav for an extended period of tome, both pre-patch (no upkeep), and post patch (nerfed lancing angle & upkeep), and I found it easymode.
2. I am a polearm user, therefore cav generally don't target me. This means I have less of a bias than other infantry.
3. I've most probably been here longer than you, and have more experience.
I'm being honest here. This is NOT another PK ego post.
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HA and HX are anti lancer
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In NA I noticed a guy called HeavenHill_of_Crafty who often tops the killboard as cav with a charger. I saw him once his horse died, and he couldn't even block at all. #soskilled.
Of course as All Crafty Players Are From Japan And Have The Ping For Japan.
Great Example.
Damn those Japanese Players for playing on our servers and having problems with ping! Oh wait :rolleyes:
I forgot how retarded the c-RPG community is.
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Just some people in the community are retarded, and thankfully they all open their mouths and point "ME ME ME" so they're easy to recognize.
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1. Ok, you didn't ask to create a PK sub-branch in EU servers.
2. Us melee 'elitists' believe that melee is the only way to play, because it requires the most skill. There's no blocking associated with 'shooting' or 'cav'.
3. I did cav for 3 gens, and thus, am quite adequate at it.
4. I find it ironic that you suggest I roll into "shooting" and "cav", and that I need to grow a set. Those classes are the text-book definition of vagina.
5. Yes, you do go against everything I say, or any other PK's, because it's us.
6. Be realistic, if you couch anyone, with one of those twig-like lances (not great or jousting) would you expect it not to break, considering a tincan would typically weigh ~100kg+, and those lances are pin-dick thin, hitting them at say, 40km/h? At the very least, it'd go through them, resulting in the splintering or loss of the lance.
1. True.
2. There is no blocking associated with cavalry or archery. Shit, even noobs can block nowadays. It's nothing special ya know? Battle is about more than just blocking and getting the killing strikes.
3. Oh you played a class you claim to be op for 3 gens. Wonder why :DD. I have played 4 or 5 gens as a lancer and had multiple alts that have been cav.
4. Indeed you definetly need to grow a set because obviously you don't have any balls to admit that those two classes require similiar amount of skill. Are you trying to compensate something when you only play melee and say it's the only skill class?
5. Yeah it might be the case at this point because you never say anything that is original or potentially good for the mod.
6. Not if you hit the head :P. But be realistic yourself then. 2h sword swing cutting through plate armor like it was butter? HELL NO!
Now, here's some reasons why my observation is more valid than yours;
1. I was a dedicated cav for an extended period of tome, both pre-patch (no upkeep), and post patch (nerfed lancing angle & upkeep), and I found it easymode.
2. I am a polearm user, therefore cav generally don't target me. This means I have less of a bias than other infantry.
3. I've most probably been here longer than you, and have more experience.
"Now, here's some reasons why my observation is more valid than yours;" ah this sounds promising...
1. I was dedicated cav in pre-patch too. I was also 1h, polearmer and 2h/thrower in preupkeep patch.
2. My character is polearm infantry too when I take my horse off my inventory. What is your point?
3. You've most probably making an assumption which we don't know the answer to. Let me make another one. I'm most probably older than you, and have more experience in everything. So I win every argument now.
Get your head on straight! Oh wait, what head? All you EUmy old friends and NAmy old friends just conform like sheep to what one semi-respected player suggests.
Implying that people respect YOU?
I'm being honest here. This is NOT another PK ego post.
Sure it isn't, I believe you. You are just trying to get somekind of recognition in the website. Even the so called "original post" of this thread. There is nothing original about it http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php/topic,31833.0.html
This thread indeed belongs to the realism discussion more than it does to game balance discussion. But I guess you couldn't post your copycat thread there because Tuonela posted his into the correct subforum.
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Well, older, maybe.
And as for noobs blocking nowadays, go on NA, witness the block consistency of the noobs.
And ofc you rolled lancer so often, doesn't take a genius to work out why. If I hit up Europe anytime soon, I'll shove my long hafted spiked mace up your colon.
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Well, older, maybe.
And as for noobs blocking nowadays, go on NA, witness the block consistency of the noobs.
And ofc you rolled lancer so often, doesn't take a genius to work out why. If I hit up Europe anytime soon, I'll shove my long hafted spiked mace up your colon.
Yeah remember to bring vaselin so it won't hurt too bad when I shove my axe in your Australia, if you know what I mean ;)
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Sounds like a pretty horrible idea. Only reason I don't like cav is because there are so many of them. Making them useless is not a way to fix them, and I don't think there is a way to fix them until people start working in a team. Cav was excellent in this era. Nothing we can do about that.
It's why I play siege and rageball a lot.
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Sounds like a pretty horrible idea. Only reason I don't like cav is because there are so many of them. Making them useless is not a way to fix them, and I don't think there is a way to fix them until people start working in a team. Cav was excellent in this era. Nothing we can do about that.
It's why I play siege and rageball a lot.
As bad as the idea may be, I still think it's more sensible than Thomeks Drag Car horse thread, where the main concept was that they can't turn adequately to be of any use. Cav do well, because the typical awareness in a big-scale battle is close to none, for some reason... Yet one would think -would- be developed due to the continuing influx of cav on EU and NA servers?
Therefore, to compensate for the poor awareness of the typical player, that's one reason I deemed a nerf to cavalry necessary, as there's a lot more infantry than there are cav, deeming the infantry as easy pickings for the most part.
And so far, I think this is probably... the most realistic approach to the matter at hand, as the twig-lances (light to heavy) are skinny, and would likely... not last more than one or so charges.
Couching lances would of course, be devoid of the breaking principle.
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I don't support Thomeks thread either.
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In 1257 AD there's this nice thing where if a horse runs into a prepared spear it counts as a couch against the horse, typically killing the horse outright
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Son of Odin, look around you right now look at your gut, your greasy man-child hands and ask yourself if you are really that sad that you get your kicks from being a loser on an Role Playing Game forum.
PK Black Wind here does know what he is talking about. Cav is indeed an effective role to play but it lacks the depth and intensity that melee combat generates. If lances were to break after a certain amount of damage delivered or amount of couches or stabs then lances could be longer and better without being overpowered. Lance cav would have to think twice before couching or stabbing at a shield user.
Son of Odin leave this post. You are not qualified to comment on the finer intricacies of cRPG and you are not respected by the community or your own cRPG peers.
How do you know how old Black Wind is anyway? Do not waste forum space PM me if you have a serious response.
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This feels like the only way to balance cav... it would force them to carry a good sidearm, so we wouldn't see anymore lancer cav carrying a giant polearm/2h on their back. Pretty stupid seeing cav go around lancing person after person, and unlike some people say, its easy to outrange the 2h greatswords if you know what your doing, Huey, Rohypnol, Hobb and many other good cav do it all the time. I made a cav alt and im even able to do it when i try hard, and im speaking from the perspective of my 2h main and from my cav alt. Playing on my cav alt, im able to maintain like a 3:1 KD ratio and i am terrible at cav, haven't played it since the beta of warband. And you can say that the good players are aware and can sidestep cav, or carry a pike etc, but fact is, eventually those players are gonna get locked down in a melee fight where they cant pay full attention to the cav. This would also force cav to pick their targets, so they cant just go rambo and lance everything in sight, or waste their lance couching the late spawners/afks.Also, on a realism note, Knights would normaly drop their lances after the first charge, if they were still even intact (which was highly unlikely). This suggestion would make cav less appealing, but still viable, so we wont see 15 people out of the 40 man team on horses. Not to mention, it might make the double sided lance useful.
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I don't see how making lances more powerful and easier to use while at the same time making them ammo based weapons will make the role any more skillbased. It's actually the opposite because the difference between a good and a bad cav player would be reduced, the good player being unable to make more kills than what the lance can sustain before breaking. Just like what would happen if maneuver was nerfed.
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Well in the case lances broke they would fight with swords from horseback. This is actually realistic... now, balanced... take your pick.
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Then remove the ability for the majority of polearms to stop horses. And remove increased leg damage. Otherwise all those inevitable 1h cav would have a pretty shit time.
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Naked horses can already survive headshots from my longbowman, so I'd say they dont need to be buffed more.
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Well along with my other suggestions that are probably not going to be implemented anyways, I think increasing damage done to the head while decreasing or removing the leg damage increase will fit a favorable balance between a cav nerf while rewarding the skill of the cav player.
How it helps other classes:
-Skilled archers can kill cav easier.
-Most ranged would be able to protect themselves from frontal assaults even better once they see the horse instead of the horse tanking hits.
-Defines a clear target to attack the horse for melee. It will be harder to hit the head, but more rewarding. Sidestepping and hitting the body/legs may not kill the horse. Stabs will be much more dangerous now.
-1h still a little crappy against cav, but some of the 1h stabs will be able to hit the horse head among the very skilled. Any suggestion I think of buffing shield vs cav will just get ignored.
How it helps cav:
-No more horse getting 1shot by teammates as easily.
-More interesting cav vs. cav duels
-Skilled cav must learn to control keeping their horse's head from too much danger.
-If riding into a group, the guy in front of you will be the most dangerous. The ones to the side probably won't be able to 1-2 shot your horse.
How it hurts cav directly
-Focus on maneuverable horses.
-Frontal attacks are more of a challenge against skilled opponents.
-If you get stopped by a single opponent, more likely to get dehorsed by him since the head is easily exposed.
Basically, I think this will nerf bad cav while keeping skilled cav relatively the same against most (I think it will help them demolish other cav more easily). Reckless moves get punished more and other classes' high skilled players will do better against cav. I'm not sure whether or not the increased head damage with removed leg damage bonus will help or hurt 1h/2h cav.
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I don't see how making lances more powerful and easier to use while at the same time making them ammo based weapons will make the role any more skillbased. It's actually the opposite because the difference between a good and a bad cav player would be reduced, the good player being unable to make more kills than what the lance can sustain before breaking. Just like what would happen if maneuver was nerfed.
I didnt see anything about making lances more powerful or easier to use... but that's because i skipped most of the thread since it was PK and fallen bitching at each other it seemed, but the difference between good and bad cav would be that the good cav will still be useful after their lance breaks, using their sidearm like a sword, axe, morning star etc. And being good cav doesn't mean you have to get a ton of kills, bumping enemies helps a ton.