cRPG
cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Topic started by: Leshma on March 21, 2012, 11:23:47 am
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This might not be the best idea but I've decided to share it with you because I don't think I've seen it here.
Whole point of it is to remove force field completely but give shielders one special buff. Instead of gaining force field by leveling shield skill they would lower the weight of their shield and at some of higher levels, but still reasonable it would become zero weight, practically the same as if they were using 1H no shield or twohander/polearm.
However, there are some issues:
- bigass shields (Huscalr) would become OP so it would be needed to raise weight of those shields so they never become zero weight
- archers would be able to shoot through shields more than ever, but I don't see this as a problem because shielders would be able to catch with them
- it's not realistic
Now, good things:
+ shielders could start wearing more armor, actually will be forced to
+ light builds using bucklers with ton of shield skill (forcefield) would become useless
+ hoplites using huscalr could be killed in a lot less time than now
+ it would force players to actually move their shield a little bit, to be able to deflect ranged projectiles
As I said, it might not be the best idea but its different :D
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This might not be the best idea but I've decided to share it with you because I don't think I've seen it here.
Whole point of it is to remove force field completely but give shielders one special buff. Instead of gaining force field by leveling shield skill they would lower the weight of their shield and at some of higher levels, but still reasonable it would become zero weight, practically the same as if they were using 1H no shield or twohander/polearm.
However, there are some issues:
- bigass shields (Huscalr) would become OP so it would be needed to raise weight of those shields so they never become zero weight
- archers would be able to shoot through shields more than ever, but I don't see this as a problem because shielders would be able to catch with them
- it's not realistic
Now, good things:
+ shielders could start wearing more armor, actually will be forced to
+ light builds using bucklers with ton of shield skill (forcefield) would become useless
+ hoplites using huscalr could be killed in a lot less time than now
+ it would force players to actually move their shield a little bit, to be able to deflect ranged projectiles
As I said, it might not be the best idea but its different :D
I like the intention of the idea and with some adjustments it could work.
However, as the suggestion stands now, it would reduce playing a 1h/shielder to practically 1h/board/manual blocking.
It would take away the shielders niche, as it would allow people to hit around shields even more than they do now. It would be practically impossible to defend a gate/doorway/bridge with a shield. Defending against ranged would be nearly impossible, taking away one of the few advantages shielders have now.
Sure, they can't catch archers now. But they sure as hell won't catch them after either.
Less shield weight means more room for heavier armour as you said, but that won't change anything in the archer catching area. So you contradict yourself a bit in that regard.
There's no difference in archer catching ability as it is now between 2h/pole and shielders because the first have more points to play around with and can get 1 more athletics easier. There's a ton more 18/21 2h/poles around than shielders. Your suggestion removes the advantage of a shield partially and gives a very slight runspeed bonus.
I don't have any suggestions on how to improve on your idea atm, but I'm sure others are more creative than I am.
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Sure, they can't catch archers now. But they sure as hell won't catch them after either.
That can be fixed as well. But I won't open such thread, I'm afraid of archer hate...
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This would make a shieldwall uselss, not too keen on this idea
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+ light builds using bucklers with ton of shield skill (forcefield) would become useless
leokings suicide will be on your conscience
+ shielders could start wearing more armor, actually will be forced to
How is that a good thing?
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I don't like it. It pretty much removes the role of shielders. We have shields and we're specialized in defending. I suppose that this would be fine for people who have just put 4 skill in shield and aren't realy specced shielders but for those of us with 8+ shield who created our whole build around the idea of being a shieldwall, it is sort of a kick in the balls. This just turns us into a 1 hander with an auto block for 4 hits.
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did evryone forget about bord shields??? norman shields and kite shields????
I have to say then fprce field is problem on smal shelds, that makes that big shields useles.
Huskral gives you ultimate protection from almos every side wich is reall anoing.
Forcefield often protect horses from hits and evryone have to say then its kind od joke.
Don't remove that, make that smaller.
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I don't know what you all want with a forcefield.
Forcefield existed in the past but now it's almost completely gone. A person can easily stab into the side of a shielder and also arrows get through from the side. Shield only protects front and maybe an inch to the side.
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which is true to most of shields but it seems that huscarl shield can block some side hits aswell
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On horseback the forcefield has to be there. It's quite insane that shields on horseback sucks up so many hits that ain't even close to the shield.
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This is silly, archers can aim for the feet so easily so the forcefield is required for the balance. Archers will probably still be faster as they have lightarmour and high athl so this probably wont change much. Also i like how you think killing hoplites faster is a good thing, we dont deserve nerfs its hard enough to be usefull as it is! :/
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Could work... only if the base shield coverages are increased to at least match with the shield models. Currently people need to have a few more shield skill than the shield requirement to get a coverage that is close to what the shield shows ingame (except with the stoopid OP bucklers).
I can't support enough the idea of shields being more than just a weak personal defense against ranged. This game has a dire need of something which is not ranged but counters range. If we are to keep the "bazooka-jetpack inertialess human" ranged mechanics we have, increasing the movement speed of shielders is a very important step forward.
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While making shielding a form of dumbed down manual blocking does sound...interesting... I definitely disagree with one of the reasons you listed for it.
More armor to shielders? They have a shield, using lighter and weaker armor is the drawback to using that nice piece of wood to protect you(or steel in rare cases). Also, I picked up a shield not to skimp on manual blocking, but to give arrows and bolts and thrown objects the finger. Don't take that away from shields. Or else...archers. Archers everywhere.
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I'm a sword and board now, and even I have to say that the Huscarl bubble is really annoying and unrealistic. It blocks side swings...
I don't find it that hard blocking with a lev 3 shield atm and that has only a small force-field. If you did away with the whole force field thing then people in a shield wall in strategus will actually have to actively aim their blocks. Maybe this will make other classes more popular in strategus. It will also make the other larger shields have more of a purpose in the game.
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This would be a huge nerf. Getting -5.5 lbs of weight would not in any way be enough to justify all the nerfs. In fact, this change would just make shields nigh useless against ranged (and still unable to catch up - archers wear light armor or no armor at all basically, your suggestion presumes shielders would need to start wearing heavier armor and 1h weapons need a lot of PS to be useful, unless using pierce/blunt)
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How is that a good thing?
They will survive longer when they put shield on their back to fight shieldbreakers :wink:
This would make a shieldwall uselss, not too keen on this idea
Unfortunately, yes. I hope shieldwall coverage can be buffed so that every single shield in wall has current forcefield values but only when its part of shield wall.
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Only change shields need is to make forcefields exactly the same as their models are. This way it would make sense to take big shields for archery defense or small shields for speed advantage and less ranged defense.
I reckon it would also be harder to strafe around shielders and making them more efficient in blocking pathways.
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They will survive longer
NOT GOOD
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And about archers...
I said I won't open new thread so I'll just say it here. They get 20% on damage output, get melee capabilities buff but also lose their kiting abilities aka while using a bow they'll be a lot slower than they are now. There you go, now shielders can catch archers.
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And about archers...
They get 20% on damage output
:lol:
Please not.
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Decreasing shield weight increases the chance of block stuns and garentees crush through(sometimes little to no damage occurs when close enough to hammer and with a heavy shield) so, those "buffs" are actually major nerfs.
Havnt noticed a forcefield with 4-5 shield skill using anything except huscarl. I often get hit by side swings, aimed arrows, jumping throwers, unless I face the attack direction. Perhaps due to server lag my opponent doesn't see my quick mouse jerk to get the block. (Pssst, Nother reason to not buff agi, server can't keep up and you will have 6-8 shield skill shielders)
So, the problem isn't shields. It's the huscarl and dinner plate.....just fix those models.
Something that decreases shield penalties for looms would be nice. Or maybe the ability to get a shield bash(does some blunt dmg based on shield weight and geometry(has a boss, or metal edges), and player can't move) that keeps guard up throughout the bash(maybe knockdown chance based on shield weight and str). (Kick currently drops guard, no knockdown, and minuscule damage)
Definately would enhance shielders gameplay.
Maybe a shield parry, tapping rmb while facing correct direction parries attack.
Causes polestagger effect.
The presented theory here is, the more offensive capability you give shielders. The easier it will be to kill them because they will be more wreckless.
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leshma if you deleted your post that doesn't mean that peps can't read that.
and i am with you ,shields need change, if i can deal witch archers with 15 agi and no shield skill then why shielders can't with moving cover????
And don't give me shit about not being able to block arrows, if you can move turn around and take your shield higer upper or lower that means then you can block arrows.
what about non ranged fights???
do the same, its way easier than manual bloking.
You want full protection from arrows in one direction??? take bord shield.
Its my opinion.
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And about cavalry...
I said I won't open new thread so I'll just say it here. They get 20% on damage output = get melee capabilities buff but also lose their kiting abilities aka while using a horse they'll be a lot slower than they are now. There you go, now shielders can catch cavalry.
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And about birds...
I said I won't open new thread so I'll just say it here. They get 20% on bird shit output, get melee capabilities buff but also lose their kiting abilities aka while using wings they'll be a lot slower than they are now. There you go, now shielders can catch birds.
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The only good suggestion I have heard thus far is nerfing shield's force-field around horses. That is a particularly annoying feature.
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The only good suggestion I have heard thus far is nerfing shield's force-field around horses. That is a particularly annoying feature.
agrre