cRPG

cRPG => General Discussion => Topic started by: okiN on February 17, 2012, 01:44:15 am

Title: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: okiN on February 17, 2012, 01:44:15 am
I have an idea for a little experiment. I'm going to start a bookmaking service where I offer fixed odds for cRPG players to wager gold on the outcomes of various of cRPG-related events like duels between players, Strategus battles, clan matches, tournaments etc. Events and odds will be posted in this thread, and an updated list will be displayed in the first post.

I'm just starting out, so I'm taking it slow for now and won't accept bets of more than 10k gold.

To place a bet: Contact me via PM or IRC to tell me what you're betting on and how much, and to arrange a transfer of the gold to me. If you win, you'll get back your stake plus winnings accorded by the odds you were playing. I trust you all know me well enough to believe that I'll always pay out to winners, and will never accept more bets than I can cover. Participants in events are not allowed to bet against themselves.

Maximum wager: 10000 gold

Bets offered: Currently none! Suggest events to bet on in this thread. Keep in mind that I'll only offer odds on events that I believe are likely to generate interest and of which I feel confident enough to estimate the probabilities of possible outcomes.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Apsod on February 17, 2012, 02:04:20 am
I have an idea for a little experiment. If I were to start a bookmaking service where I offer fixed odds for cRPG players to wager gold on the outcomes of various of cRPG-related events (duels between players, Strategus battles, clan matches, tournaments), would there be interest? And I mean real interest, because for this to work on my end, there needs to be a relatively large pool of bettors for each posted event. Would you guys actually make use of this service on a regular basis?
Sounds awesome, I would love to try my luck with some leftover money :)
For the record, I'm quite poor, so I'd only be able to cover rather small bets, a few thousand at the most. So you'd really have to bet many times to have a chance at making any serious cash.
Ouch...
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Digglez on February 17, 2012, 02:09:27 am
hah, if there was a counterpart for north america I would certainly spend some money.  we always play the over/under odds when a good fragger is the last one left on their team.

Miley, Surge, Dan-cheats, etc.....X more kills, oVER or UNDER!

wish there was a way to do it in-game and make a mini-game out of it
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Leshma on February 17, 2012, 02:20:29 am
okiN, I can fund you and we can split profits in half. However there is one condition. Both of us will sign the contract according to which we are partners and that, and if you manage somehow to lose our money in the long run chadz will give me your head on a silver platter (he has to sign that part as well). What do you say?
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: cmp on February 17, 2012, 03:16:16 am
Good idea, but don't forget that cRPG is a very dangerous place, and one needs protection from all the bad things that might happen.
I could provide such protection for a 20% cut on all the profits - it's a very generous offer that you shouldn't let slip away. In case you refuse, I won't be able to guarantee your safety.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: robert_namo on February 17, 2012, 03:17:08 am
I like to gamble my money away, count me in. I'm serious.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Stabby_Dave on February 17, 2012, 03:21:45 am
Excellent money making scheme. I offer 3/1 odds that next patch will see an archer nerf :D

Also:
Good idea, but don't forget that cRPG is a very dangerous place, and one needs protection from all the bad things that might happen.
I could provide such protection for a 20% cut on all the profits - it's a very generous offer that you shouldn't let slip away. In case you refuse, I won't be able to guarantee your safety.

I like that you literally just changed your profile picture to match this post.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Leshma on February 17, 2012, 03:30:20 am
Good idea, but don't forget that cRPG is a very dangerous place, and one needs protection from all the bad things that might happen.
I could provide such protection for a 20% cut on all the profits - it's a very generous offer that you shouldn't let slip away. In case you refuse, I won't be able to guarantee your safety.

We are talking about big numbers here and frankly speaking, you're too small fish for this kind of job, Mr. Corleone :)
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: ManOfWar on February 17, 2012, 05:01:18 am
Seems a Crpg mafia is in the works

Whose kneecaps are going to be broken first?

Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: TurmoilTom on February 17, 2012, 05:03:38 am
Seems a Crpg mafia is in the works

Whose kneecaps are going to be broken first?

I volunteer PieParadox.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: MrShine on February 17, 2012, 06:16:43 am
I have some extra cash to throw around - this would be pretty fun :D
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: okiN on February 17, 2012, 08:58:37 am
okiN, I can fund you and we can split profits in half. However there is one condition. Both of us will sign the contract according to which we are partners and that, and if you manage somehow to lose our money in the long run chadz will give me your head on a silver platter (he has to sign that part as well). What do you say?

How much money are we talking, here? You got a few million on hand?

Anyway, I'd still be the one doing all the work, so 50-50 is out of the question. If you bankroll me with a significant amount, I could maybe offer you 10%. And no guarantees, obviously. Like I said, it's an experiment. :wink:

hah, if there was a counterpart for north america I would certainly spend some money.

NA players more than welcome here, but yeah, I wouldn't be offering much in the way of NA-specific events, since I wouldn't really know where to fix the odds.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Gnjus on February 17, 2012, 09:01:13 am
Poor people, beggars and peasants shouldn't be starting betting business in the first place.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: gazda on February 17, 2012, 09:05:23 am
i say no, anyone who owns that type of work will get very very rich in a very short time, best of all he will get rich of stupid peoples money, just like in real life. i think thats morally unacceptable, especially for a global moderator
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: okiN on February 17, 2012, 09:06:16 am
Poor people, beggars and peasants shouldn't be starting betting business in the first place.

I have enough of a stake right now to cover bets of around 5k (assuming a few dozen bets per event), that's enough for me to see how this whole thing works out. The ceiling might be raised in the future if the turnaround is small enough for me to manage more or I come into more money, but it's not really a big thing for me. I'm never going to be accepting bets in the millions either way, because unlike IRL bookies I don't have many options available to me in terms of controlling the risks. :P

i say no, anyone who owns that type of work will get very very rich in a very short time, best of all he will get rich of stupid peoples money, just like in real life.

Well, we already have the market, which works on the exact same principle, so...
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: gazda on February 17, 2012, 09:12:27 am
Well, we already have the market, which works on the exact same principle, so...

getting rich trough marketplace takes way more time and awareness while here you would get richer and richer with every day, if there would b interest in something like this
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Gnjus on February 17, 2012, 09:17:05 am
I have enough of a stake right now to cover bets of around 5k (assuming a few dozen bets per event), that's enough for me to see how this whole thing works out.

5k ? My horse's pile of shit is worth more, especially if i feed him with crazy mushrooms that you can recycle, I might as well open a bookie's place on my own with people betting on whether his next poo is gonna be hard or liquid. :wink:
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: okiN on February 17, 2012, 09:20:38 am
Good luck with that. :P

getting rich trough marketplace takes way more time and awareness while here you would get richer and richer with every day, if there would b interest in something like this

You say that like there's no risk on my end. Even with a slight overround, I still need to fix the odds right or I might be facing huge losses. I'm not going to be magically making massive profits on each book regardless of what I do.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: gazda on February 17, 2012, 09:30:25 am
make the odds right and you shall prosper :wink: well if there are fools that will bet, good luck
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: okiN on February 17, 2012, 10:38:05 am
Have you seen the film "Bad Lieutenant"? It stars Harvey Keitel as a bent cop who, among other things, plays bookie to his friends on the force, conning them into placing what he thinks are bad bets while he bets their stakes against them with a mob bookie -- guess how he ends up. Point being, even the house can lose. :wink:

Anyway, I've had an offer of financial backing (no strings, score!), so I could easily raise the maximum bet to 10k now, maybe even 20k depending on how it goes. However, I'm still not sure if it's worth doing given the response. Need more punters!
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Siiem on February 17, 2012, 10:46:15 am
cRPG Premier League!
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Nessaj on February 17, 2012, 11:11:47 am
visitors can't see pics , please register or login
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Teeth on February 17, 2012, 04:10:00 pm
Anything that gives me a chance to earn faster money than I do by playing is supported by me.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Bjord on February 17, 2012, 04:17:33 pm
I'll bet on myself and become rich.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Dravic on February 17, 2012, 06:14:14 pm
okiN, I admit that you managed to remind me of my plans. I planned to make a lottery, and finally - here it is!

http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php/topic,26322.msg381894.html#msg381894
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Thovex on February 17, 2012, 06:43:47 pm
I'll bet on myself and become rich.

Not anymore.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Leshma on February 17, 2012, 09:13:01 pm
How much money are we talking, here? You got a few million on hand?

Anyway, I'd still be the one doing all the work, so 50-50 is out of the question. If you bankroll me with a significant amount, I could maybe offer you 10%. And no guarantees, obviously. Like I said, it's an experiment. :wink:

Such big words from such a poor squire. Do you even have 200000 chadzian coins in your stash?

No, I don't have couple of millions to invest in your project. But I can give you one million of these:

(click to show/hide)

Anyways, my share would be 20%, or I could lend you money but you'll have to pay interest rates. What do you say, deal or no deal?
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: okiN on February 17, 2012, 10:10:27 pm
Such big words from such a poor squire. Do you even have 200000 chadzian coins in your stash?

No, I don't have couple of millions to invest in your project. But I can give you one million of these:

(click to show/hide)

Anyways, my share would be 20%, or I could lend you money but you'll have to pay interest rates. What do you say, deal or no deal?

I have that much, and no deal. Like I said, I already have someone who offered to lend me money for this without even asking for a cut. :P
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Logen on February 17, 2012, 10:50:21 pm
Sounds interesting.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Idzo on February 17, 2012, 11:01:51 pm
I have that much, and no deal. Like I said, I already have someone who offered to lend me money for this without even asking for a cut. :P

Okin you're Nord :mrgreen: but your ideas pretty much quite good..

Since betting thing has potential I'll give you advice, for free! :mrgreen:

Try cooperating with Dezi to start duel thing working which I also find quite awsome..
Way you could help Dezi is to give fighters some cash.. most of ppl find dueling unattractive but for some fair amount of cash for fighters (like 5k or 10k each for fight) you could get that started.. also when fighter wins duel you reward him with few thousands...

It's all about money and we all know how much turks wants to bet since it's forbidden in Turkey..  :mrgreen:
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Leshma on February 17, 2012, 11:49:47 pm
I have that much, and no deal. Like I said, I already have someone who offered to lend me money for this without even asking for a cut. :P

You must have some turkish blood in your veins...

Fine, I'll give you my million for free and if you feel like it, you can give me something in return. But don't be an ass and steal it, please. I want so badly to be part of this.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Dravic on February 17, 2012, 11:56:35 pm
You must have some turkish blood in your veins...

Fine, I'll give you my million for free and if you feel like it, you can give me something in return. But don't be an ass and steal it, please. I want so badly to be part of this.

Give the money to me, I will make lots of lotteries with really high prizes.

If you like to gamble, you can take giving your million to me as a gamble. ;)



PS

I am serious, lotteries are fun.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Leshma on February 18, 2012, 12:02:54 am
Lottery is for old people.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: okiN on February 18, 2012, 12:06:47 am
You must have some turkish blood in your veins...

Fine, I'll give you my million for free and if you feel like it, you can give me something in return. But don't be an ass and steal it, please. I want so badly to be part of this.

Cool, that gives me a bankroll of over two mil. Should be enough to cover a reasonable amount of bets in the tens of thousands, even. Probably better to start smaller, though, to see how it works in practice. I'll call the maximum bet 10k for now.

So okay, I'll give it a shot. You can all feel free to suggest things to bet on, if they sound good to me I'll fix some odds. :)

Lottery is for old people.

He wants free money with no risk. Me, I consider this an adventure! I have zero past experience as a bookie, so it's entirely possible I'll end up in the red. :lol:

First post updated! Let's get this show on the road.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: cmp on February 18, 2012, 12:25:18 am
How will you decide odds?
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Leshma on February 18, 2012, 12:26:11 am
It's fine. If you somehow manage to lose money as a bookie, I bet people will make fun of you and that is worthy of a lost million :P
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Leshma on February 18, 2012, 12:27:50 am
How will you decide odds?

Statistics, probability. How else. I hope he don't plan making them up, if that's the case we are doomed :lol:
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: okiN on February 18, 2012, 12:32:24 am
Obviously we don't have access to the kinds of stats that real-world bookies have with sports, but I'll do my best to track results any way I can. I won't lie, though, it's always going to at least partly come down to gut feeling, there just isn't enough information for truly reliable predictions. Still, there are ways to control the risk, so we'll see how it goes. Like I said, it's an experiment. :P
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Apsod on February 18, 2012, 12:43:34 am
I am up for a duel with anyone, I am an average player so if I am going up against someone pro like Phyrex or LeoKing they willd probably win.

Oh and my current level is 23, so yeah. Not that high :wink:
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Mosquito on February 18, 2012, 03:40:10 pm
You would probably be well advised to 'pick your fights' here ie decide your own markets well in advance and don't allow ppl to give you a 'good opportunity' for a book, that way you can get some advance interest in the event/market and also lets you get ahead of the crowd doing your homework on the field.

Have you decided the first event you will cover yet Okin?
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: okiN on February 18, 2012, 03:42:41 pm
Not yet, it seems pretty quiet in terms of events right now. That's why I suggested people could tip me off in the first place. Obviously I'd be very selective about what suggestions I'm willing to follow up on.

If nothing interesting turns up soon, I might just try to set up a few exhibition matches between some top duellists, to see what kind of response it would get in terms of betting.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: FRANK_THE_TANK on February 18, 2012, 04:27:12 pm
I completely forgot to say Okin.

In Australia we have a game called 2 up. Rules are pretty simple. 2 coins get tossed in the air and eveyone bets heads/heads tails/heads tails/tails.

You don't need to front any money as the booky and a lot of the time the game is played with out any offical at all.

What I would suggest is that you take a 2.5% cut, unless it becomes a pain in the arse, jack it up if thats the case. Instead of odds you just have a blanket wager. Bets are 2.5k so all you need to take down is who is in and who its on.

The winners get the divided loot.

Simple, fast, easy.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: okiN on February 18, 2012, 04:55:26 pm
The fixed odds are the whole point of this for me, running a betting pool would be boring. Dezilagel already does that for his duel thing anyway, and he's nice enough to do it for free. If I only wanted to part fools from their gold I'd be doing something like Dravic's lottery: putting nothing up himself, just making players compete against each other and still having the gall to take a 20% cut of everyone's stake, talk about your easy money -- and that's assuming there's no graft, nobody else has any way to keep track of what he's doing so turning it into a full-on scam would be laughably easy. Still, more power to him if there are people stupid enough to buy into it. Personally, I'd be happy to make some cash off this, but the gamble is part of the fun. :wink:
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Dravic on February 18, 2012, 06:25:02 pm
The fixed odds are the whole point of this for me, running a betting pool would be boring. Dezilagel already does that for his duel thing anyway, and he's nice enough to do it for free. If I only wanted to part fools from their gold I'd be doing something like Dravic's lottery: putting nothing up himself, just making players compete against each other and still having the gall to take a 20% cut of everyone's stake, talk about your easy money -- and that's assuming there's no graft, nobody else has any way to keep track of what he's doing so turning it into a full-on scam would be laughably easy. Still, more power to him if there are people stupid enough to buy into it. Personally, I'd be happy to make some cash off this, but the gamble is part of the fun. :wink:

I am sorry to hear, that you think I'm doing my lottery only for profit.

Yes, it was 20% rake at first, but consider this:

Ticket cost was 1000. 20% from 1000 is 200. I was selling different things as tickets - from stones to scythes. That costs too. So let's say that on average the ticket-item itself costed me 50 gold.

Is getting ~~150gold per ticket is so much? Nice joke.

Also, note, that the current edition of the Lottery's ticket's price is 5000 and the rake was effectively reduced to 10%. That gives me 500 gold per ticket.

Boooyah, so much money...  :rolleyes:


Also okiN - I don't think, that you read my thread carefully. The money I get from tickets may be used to make some other editions of Lottery one day.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Dravic on February 18, 2012, 06:53:33 pm
I remember an ingame betting system used in counter strike via a script. During round a message would say "place your bets" where you were offered to chose amount of money and than team that you think would win. Is that possible?

Possible? Yes. Probably? No.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Fasader on February 19, 2012, 10:10:53 pm
okin's scamming
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Leshma on February 19, 2012, 10:19:29 pm
Yeah, he took the money and went for Mexican border...
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: okiN on February 19, 2012, 11:30:26 pm
Nothing that elaborate, I just used it to buy myself a shiny new heirloom. :P

Seriously, though, nothing particularly interesting seems to be going on right now. I'll keep my eyes open for opportunities, and if nothing comes up, I'll see if I can't organize something small myself. I'm still not sure this whole thing is practically possible, need a few test runs.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Serfonz on February 20, 2012, 12:37:44 am
I would like to place a large bet on Serfonz in a duel against okiN do you accept y/y?
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: Leshma on February 20, 2012, 12:38:14 am
Nothing that elaborate, I just used it to buy myself a shiny new heirloom. :P

This isn't such a bad idea, considering inflation. Gold is losing on value every passing second.

I'll see if I can get another treasure chest, it won't be as hefty as the first one but I expect it to be at least half the weight.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: okiN on February 20, 2012, 12:45:06 am
Nah, I don't need more money for anything, I have more than enough to cover a lot of bets here. Just need to get the ball rolling somehow, find a good way to get started.

I would like to place a large bet on Serfonz in a duel against okiN do you accept y/y?

I actually thought about a duel between us as something I could put odds on (with me as the favourite, obviously :wink:), but it wouldn't really be correct for me to be taking bets on a contest I'm actively involved in. It could easily lead to suspicions of foul play.
Title: Re: okiN's bookmaking
Post by: karasu on February 20, 2012, 12:47:45 am
Yeah man it's obvious Serfonz wins.


Al-adin VS. Jafar gief