cRPG

cRPG => General Discussion => Topic started by: Exitialis on February 08, 2012, 01:10:07 pm

Title: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Exitialis on February 08, 2012, 01:10:07 pm
Hello!

I would like to discuss the possibilites of a new weapon that may or may not have found it's way into C-rpg.
I have a fairly stable ping at around 40, it usually stays that way except for when my computer download certain updates or request other automatic internet services.

But sometimes in battle I have noticed that the ping spikes just for a very short while, just as one have encoutered the enemy, resulting in one's death. The fast burst that one recieve varies from somewhere between 50+ ping to 300+ ping. And I know it's not an update, as they usually make the lag persist way longer, and I know when an update occurs.
It's also strange that everything remains perfectly smooth... until one encounters the enemy. (Don't need to be a big group either)
I believe others have encountered the same "anomaly", if you have please say so.

I want to know if there is any possibility, at all, that you can send an opponent a "package" or in any other way increase their ping for a very short while, just long enough to kill them?
Perhaps as an sophisticated outside "hacker" program interacting with the server, making sure the user can push a button to send a quick lag burst spike to his opponent?
If there is such a program, this is a great security threat that should be dealt with.

This is all tin-foil hat crackhead nutbag talk right? Well so was autoblock too. I'm not good at computers, but is this even possible?
Either way, I think someone should look into it, as I'm sure others have experienced the same thing.




Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Count_Curtis on February 08, 2012, 01:15:02 pm
Definitely the ping gun
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Torben on February 08, 2012, 01:18:16 pm
I often encounter this fenomenon,  charging with my horse towards any enemy,  and just before reaching him I get a spike,  a lag,  and next thing I know is my horse is killed and im flying through the air (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFto_NgmFGE)
also happens on foot before striking/blocking.

I am guessing its just a normal lag spike though,  and noticing it over any other lag spike just happens because it gets you killed.
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: okiN on February 08, 2012, 01:26:15 pm
Quote from: Torben on February 08, 2012, 01:18:16 pm
I often encounter this fenomenon,  charging with my horse towards any enemy,  and just before reaching him I get a spike,  a lag,  and next thing I know is my horse is killed and im flying through the air (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFto_NgmFGE)
also happens on foot before striking/blocking.

I am guessing its just a normal lag spike though,  and noticing it over any other lag spike just happens because it gets you killed.

This kind of rubberbanding has been happening in Warband MP since the earliest betas, and approaching enemies was always a factor in it for some reason. It's not a hack, just some kind of issue with the engine or netcode.
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Torben on February 08, 2012, 01:29:09 pm
i didnt think it was,  thanks for clarifying : )

Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Gnjus on February 08, 2012, 01:30:09 pm
Quote from: Torben on February 08, 2012, 01:18:16 pm
flying through the air (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFto_NgmFGE)

Do you maybe have a proper MP3 of this Oliver Onion's masterpiece: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1Q38sHp0SY ?  :wink:
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: cmp on February 08, 2012, 01:30:24 pm
It's not a hack, it's a technique that requires you to perform a specific combination of moves. It's very complex and situational, but certain players have mastered it and are able to use it at their advantage. It's also very risky: a single mistake will render you unable to block until you die. It's called Za Pinguspaiku.
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Tavuk_Bey on February 08, 2012, 01:35:02 pm
there is no need for such weapons. my ping rates are already fucked up by my shitty 3rd world internet provider.
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Torben on February 08, 2012, 01:35:27 pm
Quote from: Gnjus on February 08, 2012, 01:30:09 pm
Do you maybe have a proper MP3 of this Oliver Onion's masterpiece: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1Q38sHp0SY ?  :wink:

I only have the 70ies and early 80ies mp3s,  sorry mate.  think chronologically the last one would be supercop.
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: FRANK_THE_TANK on February 08, 2012, 02:04:00 pm
Hahahahahahaahahahahahaahahahahahahaah... *takes deap breath* waaahahhahahhhhahaahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahhahahahahhhaha

Lets just think about this for a second.

At your end you would need some kind of AOE program that could track the ip of everyone near you. Seems like that is something that would have to be server side.

Perhaps you could intercept all the ip address add yours to an exclusion list and then DDoS everyone anytime you got into combat or trouble. But if that was happening then everyone would notice rather constant ping variations... Not to mention that would be a pretty tall order, everytime they would have to pull those numbers out of the server...

They could just DDoS the server but thats like letting off a nuke to stop yourself from being slaped, but in this metephore your sitting on the nuke.

Anyway for those of you that like fat cops.

I present for your veiwing pleasure, Bargearse. Pay attention to the rascism, also pay attention to how old and shity it is. Completely over shadowed by DJO kick arse dubbing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GzdHZq3U4M0&feature=fvst
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: MR_FISTA on February 08, 2012, 02:28:27 pm
My friend Jeff Vader always has 0 ping for some reason and he lives by me regardless of the server and he doesn't know why.

Just thought I'd add that.
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Krakatit on February 08, 2012, 02:36:21 pm
It was happening to me as well. I switched to DX7 and it stopped but that was only fps lags i guess. Anyway you can try it as well...
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Stabby_Dave on February 08, 2012, 02:37:08 pm
Kinda related: I remember when I used to play Medal of Honour: Allied Assault on dial up. People would complain that AOL users made them lag when they came in close contact with them. I cant remember how or why this happened but I do remember that everyone just hated on AOL users  :P
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Thomek on February 08, 2012, 02:56:04 pm
There are some network anomalies here and there, but rather rare.

There are the usual strangeness of fighting someone with a high ping, or ultra-low ping (kinn i.ex). Then there are people with unstable ping, which is even weirder. The strangest thing is however some players that seem to badly connect with your player. I.ex on duel you will lag terribly against one player, but no one else will lag against him. Dunno what makes it happen.
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: MR_FISTA on February 08, 2012, 03:05:51 pm
Any reason for 0 ping on every server?
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: MrShine on February 08, 2012, 03:32:53 pm
I've definitely had instances where people will randomly lag against me in duel.  Like, they'll be fine, then they try to duel me and their ping shoots up.

I always attributed it to my mustache, but maybe all this netcode talk makes more sense.
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Elmetiacos on February 08, 2012, 05:38:45 pm
I'm not sure that ping as we see it listed is really ping... when I play cRPG, I get ping about 45-55 usually, which is what I'd expect with the server in Germany and me in England. However, when I try playing Native on a German server, ping sometimes drops to an impossibly low 25-30, and when this happens I seem to experience lag...

The more someone gets ridiculed for suggesting a cheat exists, the more I get suspicious that people are cheating. Back when I posted about the autblock cheat, I would have been reassured by the explanations if it weren't for the trolls calling me a tin-foil hat crackhead nutbag... and lo and behold, it turned out people were indeed using an autoblock cheat. I don't know how all this works, but I do know that there used to be a game called Vampire: the Masquerade - Redemption I played about 10 years ago and there was a speed hack in use for multiplayer games. I don't know about all this ping business - other than that Frank the Tank is talking a load of shit as usual - but I'd be very surprised if people weren't cheating in various ways right now.
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Butan on February 08, 2012, 05:50:33 pm
The game just generally have more FPS/lag issue when you have players close to you.
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Tears of Destiny on February 08, 2012, 08:43:25 pm
Original poster sounds like Farmer Nate
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Renten on February 08, 2012, 09:24:20 pm
Even with my normally low 18-20 ping I experience random spikes in the duel server a ton. Honestly though I expect it has more to do with when the textures switch from their far away quality to nearby quality than with some one magically making your ping spike. Normally I run around with 80-100 fps, but some pieces of armor coming into view will take me down to the high 60s low 70s along with a slight spike in my ping (probably caused by the fps drop). I believe it is because they don't have the proper distant texture. This can kill me though, for example: I'll be fighting someone when some people come closer and my fps drops as their texture qualities switch, and delays my swing input letting them get one in. There's a mod out there that fixes the distant texture issues, but it never quite gets rid of the small loading spike.

On the duel server this would be happening all the time seeing as people respawn all over the place and run back to the main fighting spot.
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Zerran on February 08, 2012, 09:44:21 pm
Quote from: Tears of Destiny on February 08, 2012, 08:43:25 pm
Original poster sounds like Farmer Nate

Nah, OP doesn't use nearly enough caps, and every other word isn't a curse word.
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Raven_Joy on February 08, 2012, 11:25:40 pm
My spouse and I have experienced this phenomena too, we call it "lag aura".
Besides all other known causes of lag, some people seem like having a lag aura while others don't.

The most reasonable explanation is:
Quote from: Renten on February 08, 2012, 09:24:20 pm
I believe it is because they don't have the proper distant texture. This can kill me though, for example: I'll be fighting someone when some people come closer and my fps drops as their texture qualities switch, and delays my swing input letting them get one in.

Anyways, I try to ignore it as well as other "bullshit!" incidents in order to keep my sanity...
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Kafein on February 08, 2012, 11:30:25 pm
Actually, people can use lag switches, and that's very easy to use. But I'm not sure it helps to make yourself lagging in order to kill others. Apart from that, any network-related cheat seems hardly doable. This is in no way comparable to the degree of "undoability" of an autoblock cheat.

However, as someone who had one digit stable pings on the pecores server for a very long time, I really notice the difference with 30-ish ping, which I would objectively consider very good. I hate 30-ish ping compared to lower because even though all your actions are near-instant, the game sorts of prioritize players by latency (either explicitly or naturally, it doesn't really matter). Maneuvering around enemies (getting in their back, being able to "push" and not being pushed yourself...) are very different when you have higher ping than them. And "very different" means that "high" pingers (that is, higher than the opponent) will be pushed away, have their movements roll-back a little, be confronted with enemies that seem to be impassable concrete walls, and be unable to "block" the enemy's movements in the same way (soap effect).
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Huey Newton on February 09, 2012, 01:51:38 am
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Slamz on February 09, 2012, 02:39:18 am
I wouldn't make quite as much fun of the idea as Frank did.  IF there is any peer-to-peer communication, it shouldn't be that hard to decipher it enough to tell which IP address represents which player.  Throw in a little aimbot code and you may be able to ping spike the player you are looking at (or the nearest enemy) and only him.


That said, I would be surprised if this game did any peer-to-peer stuff.  If it's all client-server then you shouldn't be getting anything directly from other players and would have no idea what their IP address is.


THAT said, there have been bugs in other games where doing something in the game lags people out or crashes clients.  Like they forgot to check the receive buffer and if you sent them a tell with 500 characters in it, their client would crash.  Some people make hobbies out of looking for these sorts of bugs.


But "it's something in the netcode that just sucks sometimes" is still the most likely explanation.  I'm just saying that the notion of "hax" is not very lolworthy considering the entire PC gaming market is damn near crippled by them.
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Nehvar on February 09, 2012, 02:57:31 am
Time Warner uses this weapon on me all the time.  Ban Time Warner.
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Exitialis on February 09, 2012, 01:38:47 pm
Thanks all for your answers!

Quote from: cmpxchg8b on February 08, 2012, 01:30:24 pm
It's not a hack, it's a technique that requires you to perform a specific combination of moves. It's very complex and situational, but certain players have mastered it and are able to use it at their advantage. It's also very risky: a single mistake will render you unable to block until you die. It's called Za Pinguspaiku.
I bet this is it, I knew it! I'm going to enter dual server and train on blocking this technique right away, I think I may already have found a solution:

In combat and when you start noticing a lag spike, quickly press Right Mouse Button for block, then hold S to walk backwards, then press T to open a chat window, this will allow you to walk backwards and blocking at the same time, rendering any lag weapon against you nearly useless. Then press esc quickly and enter options menu, decrease all graphics to minimum and return to finish the lag bursting little piece of shit off.
This method should be a proper block.

Another is to quickly press Alt-X then start C-rpg Launcher, enter the warband launcher and then go into the options menu, and enable dx7, make sure all graphical options is set to med-high for visual beauty.
This method will also successfully block the lag burst technique.

You could also try this: http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php/topic,25836.0.html


BTW Frank is just mad because I kill him all the time :D
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Tears of Destiny on February 09, 2012, 08:28:10 pm
Quote from: cmpxchg8b on February 08, 2012, 01:30:24 pm
It's not a hack, it's a technique that requires you to perform a specific combination of moves. It's very complex and situational, but certain players have mastered it and are able to use it at their advantage. It's also very risky: a single mistake will render you unable to block until you die. It's called Za Pinguspaiku.
Quote from: Exitialis on February 09, 2012, 01:38:47 pm
I bet this is it, I knew it! I'm going to enter dual server and train on blocking this technique right away, I think I may already have found a solution:

God damnit cmp...
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Nessaj on February 09, 2012, 08:43:17 pm
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Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Kato on February 09, 2012, 08:53:44 pm
TS i have been experienced same problem during weekend. (everything seem smooth until i engaged enemy - also while quick turning char around).
There werent lags because of players count, i spent most time on duel server with only few people.
It looked like a little lags or big fps drops for me, but in reality fps was ok and my ping stable 20-30.
I was fighting with this problems for 2 days, now its ok, but hard to say why, I changed everything on my settings (turn off/on load texture on demand, lowering graphics, changed mouse sensitivity).

 
Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Son Of Odin on February 10, 2012, 05:19:17 pm
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Damn you, I was about to post this
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Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Huey Newton on February 10, 2012, 10:09:45 pm
Quote from: Son Of Odin on February 10, 2012, 05:19:17 pm
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Damn you, I was about to post this
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Title: Re: CLASSIFIED Beyond Top Secret. The Ping Burst Weapon
Post by: Tears of Destiny on February 10, 2012, 10:47:26 pm
Quote from: Huey Newton on February 10, 2012, 10:09:45 pm
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Can't argue with that.