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cRPG => Beginner's Help and Guides => Topic started by: Zerran on February 01, 2012, 02:12:06 am

Title: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Zerran on February 01, 2012, 02:12:06 am
A (not so) brief guide on how to use a Pike.


Basics of the Basics (Stabbing Shit 101):

Most of your hits come from a basic wiggle, essentially just aim to the side or above, release your thrust, turn into the enemy. Preferably doing this while moving forward to maximize damage.
Alternatively, if your opponent is defenseless, a jump thrust can give you a nice damage boost. (This is risky though if your opponent has a chance to block you, since the pike thrust stun lasts around a full second, and therefore can give them a free hit.)

Work on recognizing armor types, and look for where your opponent is weakest. A lot of people who wear really heavy body armor go without a helmet or with shitty leg armor. Aim for the weak points and you'll do a ton more damage. The pike has an easier time picking its target hitbox than any other weapon. - as a side note on this, if you have an ally directly through the enemy, aim for the enemy's feet regardless of what armor they have, because if your ally kills them before you strike, you're thrusting an unbalanced weapon right into your ally. If you aim for the enemy's feet and they die, you'll just hit the ground harmlessly.

Jumping is one of your best tactics, as long as you do it properly. A quick jump, timed properly, can get you out of harms way, behind an ally, or give you a nice damage boost, but timed poorly it can get you a very quick and very humiliating death. Don't jump backwards to try and avoid getting hit from a chambered attack, only do it to get out of range of possible future attacks. There really isn't any way to explain when to do what kind of jump, save for the jumping spin stabs, as it's very situation dependent, you just need to practice and die humiliatingly a few times until you figure it out.

Beware of trying to hit a blocking opponent if they can reach you quickly, as if you thrust and it is either blocked, or hits something it can't damage (such as a building or the ground) you'll be momentarily stunned, this effect is called "Thrust Stun". This can potentially give your enemies a free chance to swing at you, so be mindful of this.

The Pike's hitbox is a bit funny. It doesn't start until about 3-4 feet away from you, which can allow you to stab THROUGH teammates as well as small structures, such as walls. Please note, however, that it is against the server rules to poke through solid objects by simply walking up to them, and thrusting directly through them. "Curving" around them is legal, however. This is done by aiming away from them, begin your thrust, and then aim through them, effectively hitting through them. Poking through teammates is also legal, just watch out that you don't accidentally hit them.

Choosing a Build:

(Quick Sidenote: I never use weaponmaster with my pike builds, it's useless. Just convert those points into more agi, and therefore more athletics, or more strength, and therefore more powerstrike)

The Pike actually works very well with a number of different builds. you can go 18/24 for maximum mobility. This is very much a support build. Your damage will be poor, but you can get hits in the easiest. You can also go 30/12 and hit very hard, but you won't be nearly as mobile. My personal favorite is 24/18. You get a good amount of mobility, and can still hit very hard.

For armor, I recommend going around the level of Coat of Plates, but essentially this is just up to your personal preference.


Basic Support Techniques:

A quick foreword: If you get someone rushing up and trying to kill you when you have an ally nearby, go completely on the defensive, do NOT try to retaliate. You're much more likely to hit your ally than your enemy.

1. Large Group Fighting: This is the easiest part of playing a pikeman. Essentially, just sit behind the group, poking around teammates. The pike hitbox doesn't start until about 3-4 feet away from you, so as long as you hug people, you can easily stab around them (Just make sure you aren't getting in their way) If someone charges through the group to hit you, hold your ground and block, or try to position the attacker so your group can easily kill him, DO NOT try to retaliate. If this person has a crushthrough weapon, just pray someone kills them before they reach you or you're fucked.

If you see a clusterfuck, the best thing you can do is just stand right outside of it, keeping an attack chambered, and try to predict where the enemy is going to move. Position yourself in such a way that as soon as they break free of the crowd of your allies, you have a free shot at them. Not really any way to explain how to do this, it just takes practice. DO NOT rush into the crowd and try to "help" you'll just get in the way.

2. Small Group fighting: This is personally my favorite way to play, grouping up with 1-3 allies and going on a killing spree. The trick here is to position yourself so that the enemy is forced to choose to only block one of you, while the other kills them. Generally I find the best way to do this is to position yourself approximately 15-60 degrees from your ally, as compared to the enemy. This lets your ally very quickly rush in to help if the enemy decides to rush you, and lets you stab them unhindered by your ally's movements.

Some notes from Tanken on how to play with a group, as well as how the teammates of a pikeman can help them:
One thing I might add to your guide Caita is an effective strategy of teams including a Pikeman amongst it. One thing that should be done is for your team to anchor onto the Pikeman. If you are a shielder, another polearm user, or a 2handed user, you need to be 100% aware of where your pikeman is at ALL TIMES. They are going to deal a lot of damage in your group, but without your support (as others have mentioned) they will fall quickly if swarmed. Also, work as a group to get packs of people separated. Pick a target, and try and coerce them away from their group of nearest allies. This can easiest be the most effective strategy in dealing with groups of 4-5 people who may otherwise outmatch you. Find them, engage them, if you can't kill them, start strafing to the side of the group and bait them so they follow--THEN get your Shielder or whatever allies you have (assuming they're competent) to engage that individual immediately and take their attention away from their current target.

As Caita mentioned, switching targets in group fights is easily one of the best strategies to do. I always like to picture myself weaving in and out of my teammate's fights to sink in shots and keep moving. This gives me two things; A) The ability to quickly eliminate a target that my teammates are in the process of fighting and they MAY or MAY NOT even know a Pikeman is in the midst, B) It keeps you constantly surveying. Even when fighting infantry you need to keep your eyes up and keep your screen moving. C) HELP. Kill the infantry that is causing the most harm to your teammate. Nothing is more disappointing than a Pikeman, meant for support, engaging an enemy too long and NOT helping kill an otherwise easy infantry kill for the Pikeman. and D) NEVER MISS A HORSE. That horse you missed trampling one of your teammates because you got Tunnel Vision? Guess what, that horse was Huey Newton, or Badplayer, or Rohypnol planting a bolt in someone's dome...You just fucked it up and now you'll be lucky to have another chance to catch them.

One last thing for group fighting, PAIR UP WITH YOUR FAVORITE SHIELDER. If you can communicate with them effectively (skype, ventrilo, ts, whatever) EVEN BETTER. Let them know you are using them for cover. There are few things more startling to enemies than seeing a Pikeman paired effectively with a shielder...get a shield wall with a few pikeman behind and you can hear the piss filling their plated boots. When your team engages, let them engage in front of you. If you can't manage to weave in and out of the line and keep your distance--JUMP. Step 10 feet back from the line, pick a target, and prepare an attack. Then, rush forward and jump and bring the pike down. There has been so many times I would have otherwise struck a teammate or missed if I had not employed jump-tactics with the Pike.

3. Anti-cav: Pikes are, contrary to popular belief, far from the best anti cav weapon. Long Spear and Bamboo Spear are vastly superior anti cav weapons. This is due to the speed difference between the pike and these weapons. Pike is slow as balls, so you need to be chambered quite a bit before the cav get near you, or they'll just lance you before you can get your thrust ready. If you see cav charging you, and an ally is in the way, I'm sorry to say the only thing you can do is try to get positioned such that as soon as the cav runs over/ impales your ally you can stab the horse. It's tempting to try and rush forward to stop the cav before they reach your ally, but more often than not this will just end up with your ally getting in the way and you either stabbing your ally, or not being able to get a hit in and you both get run over, and the cav runs free. Many cav will turn away before reaching your ally anyway if they realize there's a pikeman waiting right afterwards to stop them.

ALWAY AIM FOR THE HORSE. If you strike at the rider they'll more than likely just block you, since you have to be chambered long before they reach you, and because only retarded cav will try to outrange you, they'll be playing defensively.

Generally the only way to take out cav with a pike is by sneak attacks, you're much more useful working as a mobile anti-cav wall, rather than for actually killing them. Do watch out for sudden charges though, as these can potentially catch you without enough time to chamber your attack.

4. Picking your targets. #1 priority is stopping any cav rushing towards your allies, however most cav aren't dumb enough to charge at an aware pike, so just keep this in the back of your mind, and stay alert.
                                     #2 priority is split between crushthrough weapons and other pikemen/longspears. These can be extremely deadly in group fights, and are the greatest threat to you as well.                             
                                     #3 is hoplites. Often an underestimated class, they fill a similar role as you do. The reason they're #3 rather than tied for #2 is simply because their shield allows them to be better equipped to stop your attacks
                                    #4 is 2H and other Polearms. They can deal heavy damage, but have little ability to protect themselves from you.
                                    #5 is shielders. They have the best ability to stop your attacks, and pose relatively little threat.

Also a good note from [ptx] on dealing with other support polearms:
What i could add is that as far as fights between pikes, long spears, bamboo spears and hoplites go, the longer weapon almost always beats the shorter one. Pike is the ultimate anti-long spear weapon, long spear is the ultimate anti-bamboo spear/hoplite weapon. In a group fight, one of these effectively renders enemies with shorter stabbers completely helpless.

A note about picking targets: Watch out for the really good players. They need to be raised on your priority list dramatically. If you notice there's one or two players on the enemy team who are simply tearing your team to pieces, try to get sneak shots in on them. Even the best players have a hard time blocking multiple enemies as well as a pikeman.

Also a quick note about ranged. Archers in particular seem to be really really bad at estimating when you can hit them. A quick jump stab headshot at the last minute has got me many a kill against ranged.

1v1 Fighting:

Pikes are poor 1v1 weapons, however this does not mean you're defenseless, in fact against some people the pike is a very good choice for 1v1, simply because they assume you're going to be an easy kill.

1. Choosing a sidearm: Some pikers decide to not use a sidearm, and with a longspear I can understand this. Longspear has very few situations where it's totally useless. Pike, on the other hand, has situations where it is 100% worthless. Some examples are: In very confined quarters (such as the bottom of the ruined buildings, or alleyways), or against crushthrough weapons. A lot of people choose to use the quarterstaff as their sidearm, but personally I prefer using the Italian Sword, Military Cleaver, Military Pick, or (my personal favorite) the langes messer. You don't even really need wpf to be effective with these, however I recommend putting some in anyway. Even with no weaponmaster you can go around 80 wpf in 2 weapons, or do 100 in one and 55 in another. This is largely just personal preference, try things out and see what works for you.

2. Switching to the sidearm: It can often be tricky to decide exactly when to switch, or even HOW to switch to your sidearm. Don't try it if your opponent is swinging away at you, you'll get yourself killed. See #3 below on how to deal with spammers.

One technique that has gotten me a fair number of kills, is to charge towards the enemy with the pike chambered, and right before the tip of the pike reaches them, pull out your side arm and spam 2-3 hits. Many people can't adjust fast enough from fighting a 1 direction pikeman to fighting a 3-4 directional player to immediately start blocking you. Therefore, while they're still downblocking you can often get a couple free hits in.

Other than that, one decent time to switch is immediately after a successful jump thrust, or even before you reach your opponent at all.

3. 180 Jumping Spin Stab: My personal favorite technique for 1v1 with the pike. It's very useful against spammy opponents looking to kill you as quickly as possible. First, wait for them to run up to you, and block their first couple hits, while backpeddling. You want to give the appearance of being overwhelmed and helpless. Immediately after, or even in the act of, blocking one of their hits, run FORWARD, trying to run past them. As soon as you get next to them, begin chambering your attack and jump FORWARD, release your attack and turn 180*, stabbing them right as you land.

This takes a lot of work to perfect, and will lead to many a humiliating death at first. Don't give up, just keep trying.

4. 360 Jumping Spin Stab: A bit more advanced the the 180, but possibly even more useful. The basic idea is the same, the difference being that rather than running past them before jumping, you simply turn around and jump. The problem is that if they decide to do a quick attack right before you jump, you get stabbed in the back. The trick with this is to wait for them to pause for a moment. If they're spamming as fast as they can, don't try this. The big advantage here is that you appear to be even more vulnerable, and most people will try to get a hit in, which can allow you to get a nice stab past their down block.


These sections (3+4) will need to be revised after I have a chance to test the new slowed down thrust-turns, so disregard for now.

5. Backwards Jumping: This is useful for getting away from an enemy that can't retaliate (For example a downed cav), but if they can retaliate DO NOT TRY A BACKWARDS JUMP. It works with the longspear, but with the pike it's a surefire way to get yourself killed. The pike is long enough that a backwards jump won't put you far enough away to get a hit in. You'll just hit the ground, even if you wiggle.

A final note about jumping spin stabs, don't try them on a single opponent more than about 2-3 times in a row. They'll figure out what you're up to and you'll get stabbed in the back. After you've tried a few of these, even if they're working, switch to your sidearm.

Final Notes:

1. Stay with the Group! The pike is not a solo weapon. It is a phenomenal support weapon, but if you want to go rambo, get something else. Sometimes you'll end up with a team that simply isn't cohesive enough for the pike to be effective. If this happens, just switch to a different weapon until you get onto a different team.

2. Bind your "view outfit" command to a very easy to reach button. I use the left shift key for mine. Some people seem to have this notion that cavalry leave pikemen alone. Let me tell you right now this is 100% false. Cav will keep an eye on you throughout the fight, and if they think you're vulnerable or not paying attention, they'll lance you in the back. So, stay alert!

3. Pay attention to your allies. You're there to support them, they're there to protect you. Despite this, you can't always depend on them to try to hold up to their end of that. Some people just don't understand how to play with a pikeman, others just don't really care. Therefore, try to predict how your allies will react to what you and your enemies do, and try to turn the tide of fights in favor of your allies. Even just standing nearby with an attack chambered can be enough to make your enemies slip up.

4. Don't let the anti pike trolls get to you.
One final note for pike users, don't let people get to you. They will complain about this being a broken weapon, or a noob weapon, or just OP in general. The facts speak for themselves, and the amount of skill needed to use this weapon effectively and top score boards with it is immense. There are a handful of people in NA I can think of that are great Pike Users, Caita is one of them. A lot of people will pick up a pike and use it, but until you dedicate a generation or more to it really feeling it out and really fully learning it--you'll never appreciate it's beauties, strengths, and understand it's flaws and limits.


If anyone has something they want me to cover, or thinks I'm wrong about something, feel free to comment and add suggestions. I'll probably edit this periodically.

EDIT: Just realized I probably should have put this in the Guides section, so if it could be moved I'd appreciate it.

EDIT: Added info about thrust stun and poking through objects/teammates under the Basics Section.

EDIT: Expanded on target selection, and made some things a little clearer.

EDIT: Added quotes from Tanken and [ptx]

EDIT: Spin-thrust section needs revision, will do so once I have a chance to test more.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Tristan on February 01, 2012, 03:40:55 am
In general use the Long Spear instead of the Pike.
It is faster, easy to block with and has only slightly shorter range.

Using the Long Spear there is a lot of situations where you can aim for the rider instead of the horse.

When targeting downed cav be sure to wiggle upwards.

Switch target often. Make it look like you are focused on someone else in a cluster fuck and suddenly switch target.

Avoid being alone. Until you are ultra pro, long spears work best with others.

I use a Langes Messer as side arm. It might work with a pike as well, but alas I prefer Long Spear.

My Build:

18/21. 3if, 6ps, 7ath, 7wm, 130 two-handed wpf, 120 polearm wpf.

Rememer that wpf increases damage with your weapon and lowers upkeep heavily. I strongly recommend against going below 120/130 wpf which can be achieved with only 3 points in wm.

If you want to scout someone using pike Long Spear with very good effect find Craftybadger or Bifi, they are among the best with said weapon.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Mlekce on February 01, 2012, 12:57:23 pm
many thanks sir.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Banzai!!! on February 01, 2012, 08:40:11 pm
Is it possible to be able to do 1 hit kills with a pike consistently? I ask because my current build is 26/9 and I still haven't been able to get this. I aim to get to a 30/9 build and see if having all this strength will make it possible. It doesn't help though the fact I wear plate armour with this build due to it slowing me down however it makes me take allot of hits.

Perhaps I would need a masterwork pike and a 30/9 build to do 1 hit kills with a pike?
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Tristan on February 01, 2012, 09:23:18 pm
From my experience it ain't.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Zerran on February 01, 2012, 09:24:55 pm
Is it possible to be able to do 1 hit kills with a pike consistently? I ask because my current build is 26/9 and I still haven't been able to get this. I aim to get to a 30/9 build and see if having all this strength will make it possible. It doesn't help though the fact I wear plate armour with this build due to it slowing me down however it makes me take allot of hits.

Perhaps I would need a masterwork pike and a 30/9 build to do 1 hit kills with a pike?

The trick to one shotting is jump thrusts. If timed properly, a jump thrust headshot on someone with weak or no head armor will 1 shot. Otherwise you won't 1 shot with it. (At least against inf, you can sometimes 1 shot cav if they're dumb enough to not block you.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Gurnisson on February 01, 2012, 09:25:44 pm
Is it possible to be able to do 1 hit kills with a pike consistently? I ask because my current build is 26/9 and I still haven't been able to get this. I aim to get to a 30/9 build and see if having all this strength will make it possible. It doesn't help though the fact I wear plate armour with this build due to it slowing me down however it makes me take allot of hits.

Perhaps I would need a masterwork pike and a 30/9 build to do 1 hit kills with a pike?

The pike is slow so it's perfectly viable to one-hit kill with. I've tried it with 27/12 and 30/9 and the slowness of the pike makes it easy to aim for the head. If you time your movement right you'll often one-hit to the face.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Kafein on February 02, 2012, 12:01:07 am
Level 30 (4 420 577 xp)

    Strength: 27
    Agility: 15
    Hit points: 62

    Skills to attributes: 14

    Ironflesh: 0
    Power Strike: 9
    Shield: 0
    Athletics: 5
    Riding: 0
    Horse Archery: 0
    Power Draw: 0
    Power Throw: 0
    Weapon Master: 3

    One Handed: 1
    Two Handed: 1
    Polearm: 130
    Archery: 1
    Crossbow: 1
    Throwing: 1

Held body thrusts often result in oneshots, and 5 ath is enough to follow my teammates (assuming medium armor). Basically all onehanders or weapons most often used by archers work as sidearm.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: isatis on February 02, 2012, 01:13:13 am
my best advice for piker: get a friend!

did you ever saw one pikeman+ one fast mauler+ one shielder...

impossible to beat, shieldy get arrow, pike poke and mauler crush you with over head while piker attack as soon as you try to hit the mauler, and cav basically got killed by piker

also, a lot of cav love e-peening by killing pikeman, my tip: let them go near and kill them if they underestimate reach, if they charge: title and you'll see and try a magic jump return tostop horsy (very difficult, you'll get killed by good cav)

also, beware of couching cav as they can grave kill you

(pic:)

(click to show/hide)

good guide
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: ertle on February 02, 2012, 03:08:13 am
my best advice for piker: get a friend!

did you ever saw one pikeman+ one fast mauler+ one shielder...

impossible to beat, shieldy get arrow, pike poke and mauler crush you with over head while piker attack as soon as you try to hit the mauler, and cav basically got killed by piker

also, a lot of cav love e-peening by killing pikeman, my tip: let them go near and kill them if they underestimate reach, if they charge: title and you'll see and try a magic jump return tostop horsy (very difficult, you'll get killed by good cav)

also, beware of couching cav as they can grave kill you

This. I just recently started piking and if you're by yourself you're dead. But with teammates and being aware of the situation your squad can outlast (almost) anything. Something to add, don't pay too much attention to your K/D because again the pike is ultimately a support weapon. By just poking you either stagger them or force them to downblock which creates openings for others to take advantage of. And use the jump stab in moderation good players expect it. Use it on downed cav or that extra bit of reach don't constantly do it.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Kekn on February 02, 2012, 11:04:32 am
I haven't played pikeman (yet), but I'm assuming the hitboxes are the same as native?

If so, I would say there's a part missing about how you hit through your teammate and hit the opponent as well as the stun effect on shielders which basically works as a kick - that is no retaliation, no chance of blocking.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Zerran on February 02, 2012, 01:28:33 pm
I haven't played pikeman (yet), but I'm assuming the hitboxes are the same as native?

If so, I would say there's a part missing about how you hit through your teammate and hit the opponent as well as the stun effect on shielders which basically works as a kick - that is no retaliation, no chance of blocking.

I mentioned briefly that you can hit through teammates in the Large Group Fighting section, but I'll expand on it a bit. As for the stun effect, again, I mentioned it somewhere very briefly but I'll also expand on that.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Toffi on February 02, 2012, 01:47:06 pm
and because only retarded cav will try to outrange you, they'll be playing defensively.

As a horsemen I have to say it's not true. The pike is very weak against enemy cav. I don't hesitate to charge a pikemen straight, cause most of the time, if they are not good enough, they think as long as they look at me I won't charge them, cause, as you say, it must be completely retarded. So the surpise element is on my side, the pike far too slow and you need perfect timing for that.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Zerran on February 02, 2012, 02:06:41 pm
As a horsemen I have to say it's not true. The pike is very weak against enemy cav. I don't hesitate to charge a pikemen straight, cause most of the time, if they are not good enough, they think as long as they look at me I won't charge them, cause, as you say, it must be completely retarded. So the surpise element is on my side, the pike far too slow and you need perfect timing for that.

Hmm, maybe it's just me then. The only time I get killed by cav when I've seen them and prepared is if I completely derp and miss them, which happens at most 1 out of 30 times. With the longspear though it does happen sometimes, as the longspear only outranges the lance if the longspear is aiming at the horse by about 50 cm, which can be tricky to time. The pike outranges them by a full meter or more, which takes some pretty awful timing to mess up.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Kekn on February 02, 2012, 04:35:07 pm
I mentioned briefly that you can hit through teammates in the Large Group Fighting section, but I'll expand on it a bit. As for the stun effect, again, I mentioned it somewhere very briefly but I'll also expand on that.

I'm not talking about thrust, it's the overhead that is really deadly. Held overheads can stun a shield user in order to completely remove the shields effect - as if it wasn't there - which enables a teammate to quickly follow up with an attack that will hit clean. Furthermore, to really make this useful in a teamwork situation, you can actually make an overhead attack THROUGH your teammate and hit the enemy he is facing.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Zerran on February 02, 2012, 04:42:45 pm
I'm not talking about thrust, it's the overhead that is really deadly. Held overheads can stun a shield user in order to completely remove the shields effect - as if it wasn't there - which enables a teammate to quickly follow up with an attack that will hit clean. Furthermore, to really make this useful in a teamwork situation, you can actually make an overhead attack THROUGH your teammate and hit the enemy he is facing.

Ohh no, pikes in C-rpg don't have the overhead anymore, it was removed. They can only thrust.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: CrazyCracka420 on February 02, 2012, 05:55:04 pm
Nice guide, and for the record as a cav lancer, if there's a group of infantry I'm trying to slowly pick off the weaklings (i.e. people who can't hurt me or stop my horse), but if I notice that a pikeman or long spearman is not paying attention or is distracted I'll go out of my way to attack them.  Usually I try to take out whoever looks like they will give our infantry the most trouble, but if I can prevent someone from stopping my horse in the future by killing them now, I will go out of my way to do it every time.  They become my highest priority when scanning a group of enemies.

So you're correct in that respect.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: _Tak_ on February 02, 2012, 06:07:21 pm
put tis in guides :D
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Kekn on February 02, 2012, 06:11:15 pm
Ohh no, pikes in C-rpg don't have the overhead anymore, it was removed. They can only thrust.

Nice, glad to hear that; yet another proof I haven't played cRPG a long time ;)
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Kafein on February 04, 2012, 05:19:10 pm
Nice guide, and for the record as a cav lancer, if there's a group of infantry I'm trying to slowly pick off the weaklings (i.e. people who can't hurt me or stop my horse), but if I notice that a pikeman or long spearman is not paying attention or is distracted I'll go out of my way to attack them.  Usually I try to take out whoever looks like they will give our infantry the most trouble, but if I can prevent someone from stopping my horse in the future by killing them now, I will go out of my way to do it every time.  They become my highest priority when scanning a group of enemies.

So you're correct in that respect.

I agree. As cav, pikemen that look unaware are a near-top priority target. But I alway stay very careful when I try a pikeman kill. Yet they usually are surrounded by other enemies so it has to be quite fast and surprising for everyone. It can be very tricky.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: OzyTheSage on February 04, 2012, 06:04:11 pm
I haven't really been playing long enough since the patches so I'm really rusty... So, another thing to note is that your attacks will be chambered slightly to the right. So, if you need to stab past teammates or walls, standing to the right of them and curving the stab from right to left tends to do the trick. This also means that if there is a teammate standing directly to the right you may accidentally hit them even though it doesn't seem like you would, but this applies more to shorter weapons. You can also stab over the heads of your teamates, but then you risk accidentally hitting your teammate in the head, and even if it's just a glancing hit, it will polestun them and leave them open to attack from enemies. This is especially devastating in a shield wall, where the enemy can kill the shielder and break through the wall. You could also try stabbing from the upper right down to the left to attack over their shoulder.

Oh yeah, shield walls, if the shielders are standing huddled together, you should try to make a staggered line. This way, you should be standing behind two shielders instead of directly behind one, giving you a small space to stab between them at enemies on the other side. It's also generally safer to use jumping stabs over teammates for less risk of hitting them in these situations since enemies will probably not be able to attack you directly after your jump.

EDIT: I forgot to mention something that applies to just about everybody, but is useful for pikers to switch to their sidearm. If you can't get away from an enemy to switch to your weapons and they keep blocking your attacks, there's a way to switch but it requires good timing. As soon as their weapon hits your block you have to switch to your sidearm and then block their next attack. It won't work if you're switching to a weapon that has the longer unsheathing animations, but that shouldn't apply to pikers.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Oggrinsky on February 05, 2012, 04:38:12 am
Beautiful Pike-man guide Caita. Thank you!
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Bobthehero on February 05, 2012, 08:53:12 am
Pike can be good agaisnt archer to some extend, with a high strenght build most archer will not survive a stab to the head, and they often underestimate the reach of the pike.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Tanken on February 23, 2012, 09:02:11 am
Absolutely love the Pike. Caita, we must start playing on the same schedule my Pike brother.

You missed this evening, we had about 6 KUTTs on, 2 infantry shielders, 2 hoplites, myself, and para in his 2hand build and man...it was doing well. As for the one-hit comment (not going to take time to quote it) It is possible if you're fighting lower-level people or lower-geared individuals. I found myself in a situation this evening of 4 vs. 8, we were losing, and I was able to effectively 1 hit 4 of the 8 people before my damn .8 second delay between shots fucked me over.


One thing I might add to your guide Caita is an effective strategy of teams including a Pikeman amongst it. One thing that should be done is for your team to anchor onto the Pikeman. If you are a shielder, another polearm user, or a 2handed user, you need to be 100% aware of where your pikeman is at ALL TIMES. They are going to deal a lot of damage in your group, but without your support (as others have mentioned) they will fall quickly if swarmed. Also, work as a group to get packs of people separated. Pick a target, and try and coerce them away from their group of nearest allies. This can easiest be the most effective strategy in dealing with groups of 4-5 people who may otherwise outmatch you. Find them, engage them, if you can't kill them, start strafing to the side of the group and bait them so they follow--THEN get your Shielder or whatever allies you have (assuming they're competent) to engage that individual immediately and take their attention away from their current target.

As Caita mentioned, switching targets in group fights is easily one of the best strategies to do. I always like to picture myself weaving in and out of my teammate's fights to sink in shots and keep moving. This gives me two things; A) The ability to quickly eliminate a target that my teammates are in the process of fighting and they MAY or MAY NOT even know a Pikeman is in the midst, B) It keeps you constantly surveying. Even when fighting infantry you need to keep your eyes up and keep your screen moving. C) HELP. Kill the infantry that is causing the most harm to your teammate. Nothing is more disappointing than a Pikeman, meant for support, engaging an enemy too long and NOT helping kill an otherwise easy infantry kill for the Pikeman. and D) NEVER MISS A HORSE. That horse you missed trampling one of your teammates because you got Tunnel Vision? Guess what, that horse was Huey Newton, or Badplayer, or Rohypnol planting a bolt in someone's dome...You just fucked it up and now you'll be lucky to have another chance to catch them.

One last thing for group fighting, PAIR UP WITH YOUR FAVORITE SHIELDER. If you can communicate with them effectively (skype, ventrilo, ts, whatever) EVEN BETTER. Let them know you are using them for cover. There are few things more startling to enemies than seeing a Pikeman paired effectively with a shielder...get a shield wall with a few pikeman behind and you can hear the piss filling their plated boots. When your team engages, let them engage in front of you. If you can't manage to weave in and out of the line and keep your distance--JUMP. Step 10 feet back from the line, pick a target, and prepare an attack. Then, rush forward and jump and bring the pike down. There has been so many times I would have otherwise struck a teammate or missed if I had not employed jump-tactics with the Pike.




One final note for pike users, don't let people get to you. They will complain about this being a broken weapon, or a noob weapon, or just OP in general. The facts speak for themselves, and the amount of skill needed to use this weapon effectively and top score boards with it is immense. There are a handful of people in NA I can think of that are great Pike Users, Caita is one of them. A lot of people will pick up a pike and use it, but until you dedicate a generation or more to it really feeling it out and really fully learning it--you'll never appreciate it's beauties, strengths, and understand it's flaws and limits.


- Tanken_KUTT
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: [ptx] on February 23, 2012, 09:21:20 am
Very well written guide, i approve. :)
What i could add is that as far as fights between pikes, long spears, bamboo spears and hoplites go, the longer weapon almost always beats the shorter one. Pike is the ultimate anti-long spear weapon, long spear is the ultimate anti-bamboo spear/hoplite weapon. In a group fight, one of these effectively renders enemies with shorter stabbers completely helpless.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: Zerran on February 23, 2012, 12:46:52 pm
Absolutely love the Pike. Caita, we must start playing on the same schedule my Pike brother.

You missed this evening, we had about 6 KUTTs on, 2 infantry shielders, 2 hoplites, myself, and para in his 2hand build and man...it was doing well. As for the one-hit comment (not going to take time to quote it) It is possible if you're fighting lower-level people or lower-geared individuals. I found myself in a situation this evening of 4 vs. 8, we were losing, and I was able to effectively 1 hit 4 of the 8 people before my damn .8 second delay between shots fucked me over.

Wish I had been there. Unfortunately I crashed really early yesterday.  :( Also, I added a bunch of your post to the guide.

Very well written guide, i approve. :)
What i could add is that as far as fights between pikes, long spears, bamboo spears and hoplites go, the longer weapon almost always beats the shorter one. Pike is the ultimate anti-long spear weapon, long spear is the ultimate anti-bamboo spear/hoplite weapon. In a group fight, one of these effectively renders enemies with shorter stabbers completely helpless.

Gah! I can't believe I forgot to add this. Thank you sir, I put your quote in.  :)
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: oohillac on February 23, 2012, 03:18:58 pm
Nice guide! Caita is great!

I'd suggest, for those having trouble with the pike or longspear (like I do), also give the bamboo a shot. It's very fast, and the guide is still applicable.
Title: Re: A Guide on using the Pike
Post by: ShinySpoons on February 25, 2012, 10:41:43 pm
The nice thing about bamboo is the overhead. A Heavy/light lance also makes a halfway decent pike/hoplite weapon.