cRPG

cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Realism Discussion => Topic started by: POOPHAMMER on September 29, 2011, 10:42:59 pm

Title: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: POOPHAMMER on September 29, 2011, 10:42:59 pm
Remember when they did? I do, bring it back! Unless there is some reason arrows magically fly through solid objects on the backside, but not the front when its being held. I am also saying this as an archer.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Bulzur on September 29, 2011, 11:23:01 pm
It didn't entirely block it, no ?
I thought shield on the back had a chance to reduce missile damage by 50%, or something like this ? Anyway, a shield on the back already slows down the poor guy, i don't mind letting him carry one on the back WITH NO FORCEFIELD. If it hits the "shield", it has a chance to be block, else, it's a perfect hit. No forcefield with the shield on the back, only texture's important.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Leshma on September 29, 2011, 11:51:32 pm
I agree.

+1
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Tears of Destiny on September 30, 2011, 12:00:13 am
This might be the first sensible Realism Discussion thread.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Cyclopsided on September 30, 2011, 12:55:54 am
They do. They give shield armor +10 to wherever they are on your back. Only against projectiles, not melee though.

So uh, they do block arrows (or lower damage to almost nothing).
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Xant on September 30, 2011, 06:53:22 am
Maybe for some armor crutcher, but arrows that hit me through my shield on my back still deal good damage. It'd be awesome if they block the arrows completely, then I could totes be like Achilles.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fyuknIqvofk&feature=player_detailpage#t=148s

Of course, were this implemented, there'd probably need to be heavier penalties for carrying two shields (or just make it impossible in the first place..)
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Greziz on September 30, 2011, 10:54:07 am
There is already a penalty for two shields you move slow as all mother ballz godless slug mutants.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Siiem on September 30, 2011, 12:39:18 pm
There is already a penalty for two shields you move slow as all mother ballz godless slug mutants.

Its's obvious why, carrying something on your back is a lot more strenuous! And so the game mirrors that with a huge movement nerf!
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Paul on September 30, 2011, 04:31:34 pm
Remember when they did?

no

always been like this afaik:

if hit_shield_on_back:
   armor += shield_resistance + 10
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: POOPHAMMER on September 30, 2011, 04:40:44 pm
no

always been like this afaik:

if hit_shield_on_back:
   armor += shield_resistance + 10

I must be mistaken, I could swear I remember arrows being caught on the shield while I had it on my back
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Belatu on September 30, 2011, 04:46:16 pm
ONLY ARROWS?? Is just ARCHER HATE, or is the smell of the shit going down your pants direct to the socks what is hitting my nose thread after thread?!?!

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Penitent on September 30, 2011, 04:46:34 pm
This should be implemented.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Siiem on September 30, 2011, 04:59:40 pm
I must be mistaken, I could swear I remember arrows being caught on the shield while I had it on my back

In SP yeah!
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: ManOfWar on September 30, 2011, 06:19:18 pm
In SP yeah!

This, It would compensate for the fact that you move slow as fuck with the shield on your back.

Archers will just have to aim at your feet then
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Gristle on October 01, 2011, 11:19:53 pm
no

always been like this afaik:

if hit_shield_on_back:
   armor += shield_resistance + 10

There was a time during Warband's beta where shields on your back worked just like an idle shield on your arm. It was incredibly overpowered.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Diomedes on October 02, 2011, 05:25:30 am
This would buff the emergent class of 2h/polearm users who carry a low-mid tier shield on their back.  In a post-patch archer-buffed world, these quasi-hybrids are the way of the future.  Either get a shield or get out of the way, and if you're getting out of the way but still somehow have a shield, and that shield is on your back, then it should protect your back from projectiles.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Neostralie on October 02, 2011, 11:44:41 pm
Also, with crossbow, you could turn your back to the ennemi during the loading of your crossbow. As the middleage crossbowmens were doing.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Blackzilla on October 03, 2011, 03:43:32 am
good idea but ppl could make a wall around them... protect there frontside and backside. but i honostly dont care.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Cyclopsided on October 03, 2011, 08:33:37 am
They do. They give shield armor +10 to wherever they are on your back. Only against projectiles, not melee though.

So uh, they do block arrows (or lower damage to almost nothing).
no

always been like this afaik:

if hit_shield_on_back:
   armor += shield_resistance + 10


Everyone carries on as if not posted
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Diomedes on October 03, 2011, 04:17:27 pm

Everyone carries on as if not posted

It's important information but not /thread material.  I go into battle with 29 body armour and a 10 resistance shield.  On my back, this means that my shield gives me 39 armour but doesn't in fact block arrows full stop, nor prevent me being staggered from behind.  If ever I were, as a 1hander, to put my shield on my back I'd hope it would at least prevent staggering by arrows.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: ManOfWar on October 03, 2011, 06:52:48 pm
It's important information but not /thread material.  I go into battle with 29 body armour and a 10 resistance shield.  On my back, this means that my shield gives me 39 armour but doesn't in fact block arrows full stop, nor prevent me being staggered from behind.  If ever I were, as a 1hander, to put my shield on my back I'd hope it would at least prevent staggering by arrows.

Ya it still staggers, it does not make sense. Maybe at least for the board shields, this should work


So the crossbowmen can use them.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Paul on October 03, 2011, 07:20:13 pm
It's important information but not /thread material.  I go into battle with 29 body armour and a 10 resistance shield.  On my back, this means that my shield gives me 39 armour but doesn't in fact block arrows full stop, nor prevent me being staggered from behind.  If ever I were, as a 1hander, to put my shield on my back I'd hope it would at least prevent staggering by arrows.

the math is weak in you. try again.

if hit_shield_on_back:
   armor += shield_resistance + 10
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Diomedes on October 03, 2011, 07:30:15 pm
the math is weak in you. try again.

if hit_shield_on_back:
   armor += shield_resistance + 10

'Tis indeed sir.  49(?) armour it is.

I'm doing a liberal arts degree please don't hurt me!!!
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: MangyHobo on December 18, 2011, 07:00:38 am
This pissed me off when an archer came up behind me and shot completely threw my steel shield.. It has to be full chance to block the arrow or it will still be unreasonable and unrealistic.. And yes arrows do stick into the shield on your back in normal m&b. unless it was just the mod I was playing...  Besides picking a shield character gives you the right to block arrows like crazy.. I've been killed more by arrows with my shield guy then my samurai.. Movement penalty is enough.. maybe add in a increase to repair cost or make you actually own 2 shields..  :evil:
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: MangyHobo on December 18, 2011, 07:01:54 am
Woops I voted for Nerf archery but meant to vote for yes
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: ShinySpoons on December 19, 2011, 07:40:55 am
Biggest problem I see with back arrows blocking is against horsemen. Guy on a armoured horse with 2 round shields becomes fairly impenetrable to missle fire and suffers no drawback except for a little bit of extra upkeep.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Gisbert_of_Thuringia on December 19, 2011, 10:52:03 am
You know another thread about this theme has been made a couple of days or maybe a week ago here in this section?

Why do you start another one instead of reading first? :rolleyes:


Here you go:  http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php/topic,21134.0.html
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Gisbert_of_Thuringia on December 19, 2011, 10:55:10 am
Hhmm...you know that arrows very often did not stick in the shield directly with the top of their tip but usually went into the shield for a couple of centimeters (except it's a steal shield)?  Don't think it would feel good to have this fake acupuncture because of all these arrows going into your back for 1 cm^^   And I think it is hard for the engine to make a difference between heavy armour and light armour on that point :/

And about the hits.  I don't think it makes much difference, getting the hit of a sword/axe directly on your back or maybe of a more or less thick piece of wood on your back. The power of that swing would probably still break some of your vertebrae (those tiny little things in your spine/backbone) or make cause other nice fractures in your back, on your neck or whereever.

And actually wearing a shield on your back the whole time would really handicap you while swinging a big massive twohanded sword ;)


So much for realism
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Okkam on December 19, 2011, 07:53:36 pm
the math is weak in you. try again.

if hit_shield_on_back:
   armor += shield_resistance + 10

You mean someone can have 160+ body armor with loomed armor, gauntlets and steel shield?
Looks balanced...
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: POOPHAMMER on December 20, 2011, 04:51:59 am
You know another thread about this theme has been made a couple of days or maybe a week ago here in this section?

Why do you start another one instead of reading first? :rolleyes:


Here you go:  http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php/topic,21134.0.html

Hrmmmm why dont YOU start reading first :)

Mine was made on September 29

His on November 25
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Gisbert_of_Thuringia on December 20, 2011, 08:33:09 am
Hrmmmm why dont YOU start reading first :)

Mine was made on September 29

His on November 25

Abooze!   Narf, ok you won ^^
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: MangyHobo on March 03, 2012, 08:23:27 pm
Biggest problem I see with back arrows blocking is against horsemen. Guy on a armoured horse with 2 round shields becomes fairly impenetrable to missle fire and suffers no drawback except for a little bit of extra upkeep.


Heres a hint... if your up against a horse.. SHOOT THE HORSE! Its impossible to shoot a light armored guy off his horse unless hes running at you anyways and if hes heavy armored shoot the horse anyways.. it will be slow
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Leshma on March 04, 2012, 02:17:43 am
a) forcefield created by high shield skill covers big portion of a horse
b) of course it's possible to kill rider at medium distance..
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Furax on March 04, 2012, 04:02:34 am
It would only work if the shield on the back could be broken, by both melee and ranged. Otherwise its just too abuseable.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Rumblood on March 04, 2012, 01:31:49 pm
Okay. But only on shields that take up a weapon slot.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: MangyHobo on April 23, 2012, 06:09:35 am
If you think that having something on your back would be harder to carry.. go and tell the guy who invented a back pack that he just wasted a bunch of money... then tell every one that back packs are useless and to stop buying them.....  Or better yet relies that carrying something on your back (including a shield) would be a lot easier and even in a fight..... don't just make the things stop arrows make them stop slashing attacks a lot more as well but still take some damage.. and arrows should punch threw lighter shields and completely stop on heavy ones
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Ubereem on April 23, 2012, 04:36:31 pm
I must be mistaken, I could swear I remember arrows being caught on the shield while I had it on my back
in the single player game shields on your back do block arrows
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Achelous on April 24, 2012, 12:26:44 am
terrible idea more turtles and not realistic why would you take two shields to battle that so much weight, maybe if your cav yeah thats great but you have to be killable your trying to hard to be invincible. sometimes the only thing that can kill a horsemen is a bow or crossbow because smart cav dont go near lances i would agree only if my bow got a shield installment to so i can run into battle shotgunning faces while i block melee too
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Overdriven on April 26, 2012, 04:38:08 pm
If you think that having something on your back would be harder to carry.. go and tell the guy who invented a back pack that he just wasted a bunch of money... then tell every one that back packs are useless and to stop buying them..... 

Wut?

Ever worn a full rucksack? It hinders your movement considerably...but it's still useful to carry stuff in. A big shield on your back would seriously hinder movement as well. I'd say more so than carrying it on your arm if you're strong enough.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: OpenPalm on April 28, 2012, 10:04:22 pm
terrible idea more turtles and not realistic why would you take two shields to battle that so much weight, maybe if your cav yeah thats great but you have to be killable your trying to hard to be invincible. sometimes the only thing that can kill a horsemen is a bow or crossbow because smart cav dont go near lances i would agree only if my bow got a shield installment to so i can run into battle shotgunning faces while i block melee too

You do realize that people with only one shield put it on their back sometimes too, right?  And carrying two shields makes you laughably slow?  Most of the people who would take advantage of this would only have 1 shield.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Diomedes on April 29, 2012, 12:30:44 am
I like this idea.  I place my shield on my back when I'm running with my back to enemy archers or when I can block better without the shield.  I'd enjoy a little more flexibility in how I carry my shield, especially when I'm trying to take a castle in Siege mode.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Cyclopsided on April 30, 2012, 02:53:33 am
They do. They give shield armor +10 to wherever they are on your back. Only against projectiles, not melee though.

So uh, they do block arrows (or lower damage to almost nothing).
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Ronin on May 13, 2012, 08:03:32 pm
Pavise crossbow for the win!
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Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Player_01 on May 17, 2012, 10:50:41 pm
This is something I've wanted to see implemented into cRPG for quite some time. As I know this is/was in native and native doesn't turn you into a slug when you sling a shield on your back, archers will still kite you like no tomorrow.

+1 to idea.
+1 to POOPHAMMER
+1 FOR EVERYONE!
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Paul on May 18, 2012, 11:53:42 am
Ok, now for the stupid. The hit-shield-on-back mechanic IS active in Native AND cRPG. There is just no message sent to a client about this. But the server still acknowledges it and gives the (10+shield_resistance) bonus to the armour in the damage calc on a ranged backhit. TW devs were just too lazy to code the routine that sends the message to the hit client.
Title: Re: Shields on back should block arrows again
Post by: Herkkutatti on May 18, 2012, 12:00:03 pm
Remember when they did? I do, bring it back! Unless there is some reason arrows magically fly through solid objects on the backside, but not the front when its being held. I am also saying this as an archer.
you are so sexy!