cRPG
cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Topic started by: Shpongled on July 29, 2011, 06:28:49 pm
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Pursuant to the ongoing discussion on unbalanced weapons dominating the 2h area.
At the moment in the game, a top heavy weapon is a flat disadvantage. This is to some extent compensated by high damage, but high damage is by no means restricted to unbalanced wpns (german pole, danish, claymore, flam etc.). As such, I do not think it is a fair trade-off. While a skilled dueller is indeed scary with some of the longer unbalanced weapons - eg. cmp, myself on a good day (if i may be so bold), Abdulla (name? Persian War Axe?) - it has quickly become apparent that it is only really consistently effective if the enemy is not used to the range or animations. As such, for serious dueling it is very rare to see someone using an unbalanced weapon.
Bottom line, as far as I can tell, is: Equal skill duelers, balanced wpn vs unbalanced, the balanced wpn will win every time.
Such is life, deal with it?
While that is a valid point, I think it leaves unexpoloited a potential for a game mechanic that could add a lot to variety of dueling weapons.
While an unbalanced weapon would, irl, impose certain restrictions on the user, the very fact that it is top heavy was used to its advantage. A top heavy weapon builds momentum in a way that a balanced weapon cannot. A weapon with high momentum can be very effective as a blunt force even if parried, and has the capacity to brush lighter blades aside with little difficulty.
(I apologise for the 'realism' aspect of this argument, but I am using it to point out potential for a different/unique combat style, rather than simply saying 'oh this is what would happen rl so we have to do it')
As such, I welcome comments and suggestions as to how we could make unbalanced weapons viable for top-end dueling. I'll start the ball rolling with some bullet points for a vague outline of the idea. Note also I have no idea if any of this is possible even with WSE.
- Swings chained back-to-back (ie. no parrying, expiration limit between swings) add momentum to a swing
- Each swing chained adds x% dmg, x% crush chance, x% weight up to a cap of say, 4 swings
- Each swing increases riposte window by x%
- Each swing reduces movement speed by x%, but increases swing speed by x%
What this would mean.
Users of unbalanced weapons would, at the beginning of a fight, be like they are now. However, if you let them get into a flow and can't manage to disrupt it, they get stronger and more scary. A fully-momentumed player will be a whirlwind of scary death, but cannot parry and is more vulnerable to range because of his movement speed reduction.
As such, you wouldn't be able to run up to a GLB user, block one swing and then dominate him with feints. Footwork, teamplay and timing would be key in these encounters.
I think this would add a lot of diversity. At the moment you go into all duels with pretty much the same strategy, whether they are using 2h or pole, balanced or unbalanced (excluding maulers and stabbers), and then adapt based on how the player plays, rather than to the mechanics of his weapons.
Thoughts?
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Unbalanced Weapons are not (primarily) made for dueling.
And for the suggestion, just no, we would see spamming whirwind noobs everywhere.
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No spam promotion please.
It would be better if unbalanced was tweaked down a bit, so blocking is possible for a longer moment.
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Are spammers really Spammers are no threat to an aware player who can parry.?
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Are spammers really Spammers are no threat to an aware player who can parry.?
But a deadly threat to any teammate.
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But a deadly threat to any teammate.
Sorry, maybe I'm being dense, but you don't like the idea because of the tks it might cause?
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i do like it, though it shouldn't be to much of a buff ofc
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Sorry, maybe I'm being dense, but you don't like the idea because of the tks it might cause?
100 points. People are already killing a massive amount of teammates if they're using unbalanced weapons (or any kind of 2 handed weapons), just think of them when they get in this kind of "whirlwind-stance".
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This is really logical and i think it'll give the buff already deserved for unbalanced weapons.
I always lol when i see a ninja blocking flamberge,long voulge , GLB swings with his shitty katana :twisted:
More realism=more fun i think we all play this game because we like it medieval style , if it's going to be arcade where's the point playing it ?Every realism added to this mode =WIN. That's the only game that satisfies medieval lover nerds,go play APB if you want unrealistic fast paced bullshit arcade action.
Spam/TK issue=I sadly agree what Bazinga posted also.There should be a way to stop "kill greediness" of people somehow.If community that plays this game acts like teamplayers,we would see awesome formations and battles like we experience in Mount & Musket mod but this time it would be medieval style.
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Hmmm, this would basically make people who uses unbalanced weapons to be "berserker" troops? And while I see how this could lead to more TKs then maybe that's a good thing. Noob spammers gonna spam so if they all changed their weapons to these then we could more easily spot them on the battlefield and stay further away! Would love to see someone like this jump of a siege tower/ladder making a beachfront for the attacking side :D
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not all balancing can be viewed as a 1v1 issue. You have to look at the larger picture.
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not all balancing can be viewed as a 1v1 issue. You have to look at the larger picture.
correct, to do good balance you have to enlarge the pics, only then can you do a great balance :P
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I like the idea.
However by changing this up for top level combat, would also mean morons on the regular battle server will start dominating, because of other peasants who don't know what's up.
Also, I can see people TKing to get that 'momentum' buff.
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I like the idea.
However by changing this up for top level combat, would also mean morons on the regular battle server will start dominating, because of other peasants who don't know what's up.
Also, I can see people TKing to get that 'momentum' buff.
Why would they tk for momentum? They don't have to hit anything, just swinging to build up momentum. Just like you would do IRL.
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I'm not sure about your idea, but here is my unbalanced proposal:
When someone blocks an unbalanced weapon, it should have a chance to deliver the "kicked" stun effect, with increasing % chance based on the weight ratio between the unbalanced weapon and the blocking weapon/shield.
When some 9 str ninja guy blocks my Mighty Great Long Bardiche with his puny Katana, and then immediately proceeds to slice me to death with no chance for retaliation (unbalanced weapons can't land a hit after blocking against any reasonably fast weapon), I rage like crazy. A giant, heavy axe has a lot of momentum, and you can't realistically stop it on a dime with a butter knife, but the current game mechanics allow this.
Note that this stun wouldn't be long enough to allow the unbalanced wielder to get a 'free hit', it would just prevent being counter-attacked immediately. It would allow teammates to get a 'free' hit in, but unbalanced weapons should fill this 'shock support' role.
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Are spammers really Spammers are no threat to an aware player who can parry.?
I used to think that before I made my tincan alt with a heavy bastard whose only purpose is to spam. Watching people GTX after my spamming has been my most favourite moments in cRPG. :lol: