Meanwhile in Ukraine

[Vovka]

You are still funny. How is it, that an almost BROKE nation is able to afford mercenaries is WAY beyond me...

Old trick they just  do not pay

Also - your "summary" missed the part, where rebels were mostly pressed hard to hold two major towns, until russian army invaded "for vacations" (btw - do ALL russian soldiers get to drive tanks from their units arsenal back to their villages? You know - for plowing the fields n shit?) and basically stabbed Ukraine in the back AGAIN, please don't forget that the next time you do a "summary" 

Russia is too poor to pay for tickets  so it allows soldiers use tanks as a vehicle.


http://www.youtube.com/channel/UC3_89SKNJbouTBD97k-mkJQ
Сер, Дейв что скажете про видюшки из этого канала? Там кстати "Грузин Доберман" мелькает тоже в принципе говоря про "наемников" я только его балбеса и имею ввиду XD
 
 

[Kafein]

Then please tell me Kafeine are these permissions granted by a legitimate government to be observed when that government is overthrown and a puppet installed by opposing geopolitical parties are sworn in on the back of a coup?

That view only has legitimacy in Russia, its lapdogs and a few African diplomats who recently received generous donations. Your whole point stands on EuroMaidan being a NATO coup, something you didn't even tried to prove.

[The_Bloody_Nine]

whoa, they found out MH17 was shot down!

[Murmillus_Prime]

That view only has legitimacy in Russia, its lapdogs and a few African diplomats who recently received generous donations. Your whole point stands on EuroMaidan being a NATO coup, something you didn't even tried to prove.

Most of the bullshit about Russia invading has not even been proved either and yet I've seen this accusation being spread around more than once here. Most of you don't back your shit up and when I ask molly to suddenly you want me to back evidence of NATO/US meddling in Maidan, to prove that an interview was legitimate? What else? Do you want me to pull answers and proof out of my ass?

Also in response to Anders, I don't think ANYONE here has a fact checking system, in-fact since you proposed it why don't you put your fact checking "system" to use in disproving my points? Well? Come up with facts of the Russian invasion of East Ukraine backed by "scientists" and "credible" sources.

[Vovka]

whoa, they found out MH17 was shot down!

no! within 6 months they found out what  MH17 crashed! now they need another year for investigations!

[Murmillus_Prime]

That view only has legitimacy in Russia, its lapdogs and a few African diplomats who recently received generous donations. Your whole point stands on EuroMaidan being a NATO coup, something you didn't even tried to prove.

It has no legitimacy in the nations and their allies complicit in orchestrating the coup though right? I wonder why?..

[Murmillus_Prime]

Foreign Intervention and the Ukraine Crisis

Former U.S. Intelligence Officer Says U.S. Orchestrated Coup In Ukraine

Stratfor Founder Admits Ukraine Is U.S. Regime Change Puppet (I'm posting a FOX NEWS clip, cringe! Although an interview with the Statfor founder,

Proof Ukraine Crisis Was Manufactured By U.S. Government - GMN Wake-Up Call

U.S. Asst Sec of State Victoria Nuland Openly Discussing Ukraine Subversion & Overthrow

Admittedly you'd need a little bit of patience to watch these videos through, and I don't really expect those of you holding opposing views to do so, but you asked me to back shit up and I've provided these videos two of which have ex intelligence officials giving their own perspective on the Western agenda in Ukrainne, and two videos sources from an alternate media outlet which provides video evidence of American governmental officials openly speaking of meddling in Ukrainian politics. These videos are telling and I believe the first two are particularly important as these people have been in the Western intelligence circles and have been privy to information the likes of you and me would be completely in the dark about.

Of course as I mentioned many pages ago, all the evidence you need when trying to understand Western complicity in Ukraine is the fact that after the coup suddenly offers of IMF loans are being pulled out of the IMF's arse and given to Ukraine, loans the IMF were not prepared to give Ukraine while the elected and legitimate Yanukovych government was in power. I believe the IMF's willingness to give Ukraine loans after the Wests puppet has been installed is tantamount to bribery and financial subversion, that money won't see the poor masses in Ukraine, it will stay in the pockets of Oligarchs like Poroshenko.

Nuland at the end of the last video states that Ukraine will have the future it deserves, it won't be pretty trust me.

[Molly]

Most of the bullshit about Russia invading has not even been proved either and yet I've seen this accusation being spread around more than once here. [...]

Wait, Putin himself stating that the little green men were in fact Russian soldiers is not proof enough for you? 

[Murmillus_Prime]

Wait, Putin himself stating that the little green men were in fact Russian soldiers is not proof enough for you? 

What happened in Crimea was different to what's happening in East Ukraine. It can easily be argued that Russian involvement in Crimea was sanctioned by the peoples of Crimea. Anyway please enjoy those 5 videos I posted, after all when I get asked to back my shit up at least I make an effort, unlike yourself. 

[Murmillus_Prime]

Because it is fucking irrelevant if military bases have status of sovereign states or not: Russian military took over the Supreme Court and occupied polling stations. What is it you don't understand?

No it's not. When you make the point that a military base is deemed sovereign territory and therefore based on that fact one could conclude that Russia did invade Crimea by crossing the Russian border, (of the military base) into Crimea (Under an illegitimate coup government) then that fact is the crux of the argument and can make or break the point being made, and in this case was easily broken by the lack of substantiating evidence to support the argument that the Russian bases in Crimea were considered sovereign Russian territory.

[Molly]

I actually consider time backing stuff up for you wasted. After all, you just gonna write something like "...but NATO did it before in another country." which is absolutely irrelevant.
You try to proof NATO being mean and bad in the last 10 years that you completely ignore Russia's involvement right now. What's the point in even arguing with you?
The only reason I keep posting now and then is for my own personal amusement. Getting through your "NATO enemy no. 1" attitude has proven impossible.

Butan at least seems to consider different view points. You just swoosh them away with some live leak videos... "I saw this on the interwebs!"

[Murmillus_Prime]

I actually consider time backing stuff up for you wasted. After all, you just gonna write something like "...but NATO did it before in another country." which is absolutely irrelevant.
You try to proof NATO being mean and bad in the last 10 years that you completely ignore Russia's involvement right now. What's the point in even arguing with you?
The only reason I keep posting now and then is for my own personal amusement. Getting through your "NATO enemy no. 1" attitude has proven impossible.

Butan at least seems to consider different view points. You just swoosh them away with some live leak videos... "I saw this on the interwebs!"

I can cite NATO's actions in other conflicts and cases of forced regime change and cite NATO member states involvement in the overthrow of Yanukovych, you see Molly same alliance, same actors, same result, bloodshed and chaos. Don't you realise this? You CAN'T say the same about the Russian federation though, you can't bring up 14 years worth of wars around the globe sponsored and partook by Russia but you can if we're talking about NATO. Now, this is a fact and none of you can disprove of what I have just said. Now based on these facts as they are, they have happened, its in the history books already, tell me one good reason why our media scream aggression when Russia is engaging on a conflict right on its own border but they didn't scream aggression after endless bombing campaigns by NATO?

[DonNicko]

tell me one good reason why our media scream aggression when Russia is engaging on a conflict right on its own border but they didn't scream aggression after endless bombing campaigns by NATO?

I think, because they can't scream on themselves. NATO is a huge money investments, and they need a boogeyman to expand influence and justify expenses

[Murmillus_Prime]

I think, because they can't scream on themselves. NATO is a huge money investments, and they need a boogeyman to expand influence and justify expenses

I'm a citizen in one of the leading NATO states and I can openly speak against NATO, as can many thousands of other Westerners. Yet having a voice and being heard are two completely different things. However I do suspect that the mentality being employed by those holding opposing views here is being reinforced by negative experiences passed down from family members, people posting here are from nations which were once under rule by or attacked by the Soviet Union therefore have an inherent hatred and distrust for Russians. With such an inherited mind set it would be unlikely that this thread will come to any real conclusion as the aforementioned mind set has been intertwined with these peoples psyche from a very early age.

[The_Bloody_Nine]

No it's not. When you make the point that a military base is deemed sovereign territory and therefore based on that fact one could conclude that Russia did invade Crimea by crossing the Russian border, (of the military base) into Crimea (Under an illegitimate coup government) then that fact is the crux of the argument and can make or break the point being made, and in this case was easily broken by the lack of substantiating evidence to support the argument that the Russian bases in Crimea were considered sovereign Russian territory.

I don't care what Molly's initial point was. You deny Russia invaded Crimea. I say: It was invaded by russia because their military took control over official buildings and then pulled of that 'referendum'.