Poll

Will Putin command further invasion of Ukraine:

He will and he should, because <random witty/boring reason>
He will, but he should not, because <random witty/boring reason>
He will not, because <random witty/boring reason>
Who is mister Putin?

Author Topic: Meanwhile in Ukraine  (Read 485222 times)

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Offline Xant

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #555 on: February 26, 2014, 10:14:36 am »
+1
Hahaha, really, Dave? You say the West is "obligated" to interfere if Ukraine has military problems... not. At all. Can you read? If so, I recommend reading the thing you posted:

"Russia, the UK and the USA undertake to respect Ukraine's borders in accordance with the principles of the 1975 CSCE Final Act, to abstain from the use or threat of force against Ukraine, to support Ukraine where an attempt is made to place pressure on it by economic coercion, and to bring any incident of aggression by a nuclear power before the UN Security Council."

First off, we have "undertake to respect Ukraine's borders" -- very vague, means nothing. They suggest that they will strongly consider respecting Ukraine's borders. And they also kind-of-promise not to use or threaten with force against Ukraine (too bad that Russia wouldn't give a fuck and it's not the West that's a threat to Ukraine) and thirdly, they promise to "support" Ukraine in case an attempt is made to place pressure on it by economic coercion. Support is not defined, and they mention economic coercion, not coercion by military means. And lastly...... they pinky-promise to bring any incident of aggression before the UN Security Council (uproarious laughter).

Tl;dr: You have no idea what you're talking about.
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Offline Gnjus

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #556 on: February 26, 2014, 10:16:23 am »
+1
"Guarantee"... How much we promise to women... Just what would she undressed and moved her legs.  :lol:

 :P
Do you honestly think you have any sort of moral authority, Reyiz? Go genocide some more armenians and deny it ever happened, please, and stay in the middle east.
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Offline BIA_ivani4

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #557 on: February 26, 2014, 10:19:41 am »
+2
you're very overestimating power of Russian military
Dave, you say quotations from the speeches of A.Gitler and Napoleon...  :shock: Read other authors. And do not recommend you test your theory in practice. Especially in winter time.  :wink:
« Last Edit: February 26, 2014, 10:22:45 am by BIA_ivani4 »

Offline Xant

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #558 on: February 26, 2014, 10:25:03 am »
+1
He is right about Russian military being a paper tiger. They have relatively few decent troops. Their military is corrupt and most of the conscripts receive shitty training, if it can even be called military training. And even their best troops have some really awful things they train; just look at any videos of Spetsnaz or their equivalent of SWAT, the way they train is definitely not the same as the way modern Western military trains. And it shows in their failed operations.
Meaning lies as much
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Offline DaveUKR

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #559 on: February 26, 2014, 10:32:49 am »
+1
Dave, you say quotations from the speeches of einstein and Napoleon...  :shock: Read other authors. And do not recommend you test your theory in practice. Especially in winter time.  :wink:

Here comes chauvinism again. I don't say quotes of Hitlеr or Napoleon, you just have to look at military bases of Russia and meet Russian soldiers to obtain the same thought. With the vast majority of people disliking their government because of poverty and corruption, no national idea (Moscow and St. Petersburg are fulfilled by illegal Muslims as a working power), with majority of youth evading obligatory military service by any means and military service being a kind of survival simulator for women (cleaning rooms, ironing uniform, painting buildings and shooting only like 30-60 rounds during 1 year of service). I agree that Russia has perfect special forces but you don't fight wars with special forces.

Offline BIA_ivani4

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #560 on: February 26, 2014, 10:35:50 am »
+1
Xant, Perhaps it is time to tell everyone how and when did the Great Finland? Why does it have such boundaries? Tell us, please, master of anatomy tigers.

Offline Xant

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #561 on: February 26, 2014, 10:52:18 am »
+3
Xant, Perhaps it is time to tell everyone how and when did the Great Finland? Why does it have such boundaries? Tell us, please, master of anatomy tigers.

You must be the only person ever to actually suggest Finland did badly in those wars.

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So yeah, indeed, paper tiger - as it has always been.
Meaning lies as much
in the mind of the reader
as in the Haiku.

Offline Segd

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #562 on: February 26, 2014, 12:31:28 pm »
+3
1)Finland raped Russia back there. The main reason why they lost because they run out of ammo to shoot red comrades. no fleet, no aircraft, no tanks, only will & winter.
Dave, you say quotations from the speeches of A.Gitler and Napoleon...  :shock: Read other authors. And do not recommend you test your theory in practice. Especially in winter time.  :wink:
Yep, scary Russian Winter. Was really bad for Napoleon & Knitler. But Finnish one was scarier  :rolleyes:

2)Of coarse our army is far bigger & better equipped than Ukrainian one(although they both trained like shit). But Russia will never attack Ukraine directly if there would be possibility of UN or NATO intervention. Sure, Putin is bad guy, but not a retard to start WW3.

& funny picture at the end:
(click to show/hide)


Also, there is no Berkut anymore. Disbanded tonight.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2014, 12:39:43 pm by Segd »

Offline Mwahahaha

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #563 on: February 26, 2014, 12:43:03 pm »
+1
Segd, what do you think about situation in Crimea ?

Offline Segd

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #564 on: February 26, 2014, 01:05:59 pm »
+4
Economically & Politically it is better to stay with Ukraine rather then going rogue & joining Russia. Separation will hit hard on their infrastructure. Especially if rest of Ukraine will blockade their borders. As far as I know the livesupport of the island(trade, food, etc...they even don't have their fresh water supplies, sea is everywhere) is going from Ukrainian Kherson, not from Russia.

& ppl there(Ukrainians, Russians, Tatars) also have different opinions about their future. Maybe it would be better if they'll have a referendum to decide.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2014, 01:10:42 pm by Segd »

Offline Segd

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #565 on: February 26, 2014, 01:22:22 pm »
+1
Also, the grass is always greener on the other side. Right now they(Crimean) can freely protest against Ukraine while protesters in Russia got raped again few days ago while they were peacefully(last molotov in Moscow was probably thrown in 1917 if they were invented back there :) ) protesting against jailing of anti-putin activists.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/02/24/us-russia-trial-idUSBREA1N08420140224
200ppl + Navalny & Pussy Riot got arrested.
So it probably won't be a fairytale if Crimea will became part of Russia.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2014, 01:48:15 pm by Segd »

Offline BIA_ivani4

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #566 on: February 26, 2014, 02:14:10 pm »
+4
Xant, Here is the history of your country. A lot of instructive.
Fought long fought Russia and Sweden . In 1323 is Schliesselburg peace Treaty, which stipulates that the Western and southern part of Finland, departs the control of Sweden and East Finland - Russia. Later to the 18th century Sweden loses in the war with Russia. In 1809 the whole territory of today's Finland is under the control of Russia. The people of Finland within the Russian Empire. They first receives the status of autonomy. A new state - the Grand Duchy of Finland. The country now has its own government - the Senate. Finland had its own currency, and formed a separate Finnish troops!
After the revolution in Russia there is a dissolution of the Russian Empire. In December 1917, Finland declared independence. Then between Finland and the USSR there were four wars. Twice attacked the troops Finland Russia between 1918 to 1922. Were busy Pe4enga region (Petsamo) and part peninsulas Average and Rybachiy. This Victory Finland.
From 1939 to 1940. Russia invaded Finland. The red Army wanted to keep in the period from two weeks to a month. The Finnish command, hoped that the army will be able to independently keep the opponent at least six months. Both plans have collapsed. The Soviet Union had underestimated the strength of Finland, Finland has made too big bet on the assistance of foreign powers, and on the reliability of their fortifications.
Goebbels and A.Gitler then, wrote: "the Russian army is little purpose. Poorly is guided by and, even worse, armed..." "...the catastrophic state of the Russian army. She ain't hardly able to fights... It is possible that the average level of intelligence of the Russian does not allow them to produce modern weapons." "In Finland, the Russians are not promoted. It seems that in fact the Red army is little purpose". «More of Russians still can't get... For us it was very good». "Moscow is very weak militarily..." (Dave, don't like it?)
However, When Stalin offered Finam end the war, they quickly agreed. And ceded to the Soviet Union strategically important areas. Helsinki gave up to Moscow Karelian isthmus with the city of Viipuri, North-Eastern shore of lake Ladoga, the port of Hanko and Rybachiy Peninsula. Much more than the demanded Moscow before the war. Commander in chief of the Finnish army of Marshal Mannerheim then said: "the Russian soldiers are learning fast, all quick to grasp operate without delay, easy to follow a discipline, differ courage and sacrifice and ready to fight to the last round, despite the hopelessness of the situation."
In 1941, in Alliance with Germany, the Finnish troops attack the Soviet Union. Including in 1941-1944 ensure the blockade of Leningrad from the North. Finnish President ryti then said: «...Leningrad must eliminate ...»
Finland surrendered in September 1944. German troops, in large forces stationed in the North of Finland, have not wished to leave the country. And Finnish army already in conjunction with the red Army led against them fighting (Lapland war).
US congressmen said at the time:«Despite significant losses inflicted by the war, Finland was able to maintain its independence. However, whether the USSR vitally interested in it, there is no doubt that the Finnish independence, would be destroyed. Finland withdrew from the war with the understanding of this fact and spirit to create the new and constructive relationship with the Soviet Union». The territory of Finland is now less than before 1941., however, the independence of Finns still left.

Offline BIA_ivani4

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #567 on: February 26, 2014, 02:41:49 pm »
+3
Sorry, forgot to say. In 1945, all who served in the third and sixth infantry battalion of the army of Finland, all caught. Put in train. And sent to Russia, to clean the snow. :cry:

Offline Gnjus

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #568 on: February 26, 2014, 02:44:54 pm »
+4
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Do you honestly think you have any sort of moral authority, Reyiz? Go genocide some more armenians and deny it ever happened, please, and stay in the middle east.
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Offline Boerenlater

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Re: Meanwhile in Ukraine
« Reply #569 on: February 26, 2014, 03:01:04 pm »
+1
Sorry, forgot to say. In 1945, all who served in the third and sixth infantry battalion of the army of Finland, all caught. Put in train. And sent to Russia, to clean the snow. :cry:
That proves what a cruel man Stalin was. Cleaning the snow in Siberia!
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