_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
| [0] Long Voulge | old | new |
|----------------------------------------------------|--------------------------------|-------------------------------|
| thrust damage | 18 pierce | 28 cut |
| swing damage | 43 cut | 37 cut |
|____________________________________________________|________________________________|_______________________________|
Tydeus: Dragging an overhead into a player, late in the animation, will now result in zero damage.
FUCK YOU CHDAZ NERFING THE LONG VOULGE!!!! NOW IT'S USELESS! ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!I wouldn't say it got nerfed, just altered. It's basically just a less controllable Swiss Halberd now.
First impressions:Valour should be easier to get. The 1h right swing change might not stay, I was rather hesitant about it, for multiple reasons. It seems odd(or perhaps just different) from the user's perspective, but watching someone else do it, it seems much more natural. Feel free to give more feedback on the anim, this will basically decide whether or not I make the change that the pole thrust needs, in order to be much less... wonky.
- Buff to throwing.
- Valour nerfed slightly.
- 1h has a funny animation now.
I wouldn't say it got nerfed, just altered. It's basically just a less controllable Swiss Halberd now.The only reason I used(and loomed it) was becouse I wanted a 2d weapon with insane dmg :cry:
Valour should be easier to get. The 1h right swing change might not stay, I was rather hesitant about it, for multiple reasons. It seems odd(or perhaps just different) from the user's perspective, but watching someone else do it, it seems much more natural. Feel free to give more feedback on the anim, this will basically decide whether or not I make the change that the pole thrust needs, in order to be much less... wonky.
What does Increased Score Offset cap from 1.25 to 1.5 Mean in layman's terms
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
| [0] Long Voulge | old | new |
|----------------------------------------------------|--------------------------------|-------------------------------|
| swing damage | 40 cut | 43 cut |
|____________________________________________________|________________________________|_______________________________|
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
| [0] Long Voulge | old | new |
|----------------------------------------------------|--------------------------------|-------------------------------|
| thrust damage | 18 pierce | 28 cut |
| swing damage | 43 cut | 37 cut |
|____________________________________________________|________________________________|_______________________________|
Tydeus: Dragging an overhead into a player, late in the animation, will now result in zero damage.
0.3.1.0 :
0.3.3.6 :
It should be 4-directional, too.
It should be 4-directional, too.
RIP Long Voulge... Lost 6 damage on its primary attack and can't even rear a horse now. Not sure what's up with that change.Indeed...
Nice buff for throwings cut damage.
Will see if jarid are not useless now
Yes, it is, Barsik will be happy!It is shit now
Damaging high performers gives you up to 1.5x the points. Underperformers still give you as low as 0.75x points iirc.thank-you, when i'm roleplaying, i'll try to go for the high-value targets even more now :wink:
Thanks for increasing Strategus XP, Tydeus!This.
Tydeus: Dragging an overhead into a player, late in the animation, will now result in zero damage.
Tydeus: Increased XP in strategus a lot (base and the equipment rate)
Tydeus: Dragging an overhead into a player, late in the animation, will now result in zero damage.
Tydeus: Minor adjustment to the weapon's angle in the 1h right swing animation.
Thanks for destroying our only option against backpedal...
Tydeus: Minor adjustment to the weapon's angle in the 1h right swing animation.
just nerf the fucking 2h already.
Tydeus is 2h hero...so forget about it... he will nerf anything else except 2h....
keep dreaming ;)
Fips: Map updates, added:bariyye, blue_forest, burning_of_the_witch, ice_age, prison_riot, ruIn, viking_village_siege
Fips: Map updates, added:bariyye, blue_forest, burning_of_the_witch, ice_age, prison_riot, ruIn, viking_village_siege
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fucking change the 1h swing back nowI agree 100%.
Weight is in kilograms. It has been that weight since it was changed before.hmm I guess I missed that change before then because it used to wegh more than my elite cav shield.
fucking change the 1h swing back now
Weight is in kilograms. It has been that weight since it was changed before.
please can we have the old right swing back? :(
this new one's kinda gimicky
yo, wait a moment, we're all accustomed to the old, but new to me seems more natural, the same range... just less flat angle is perhaps more natural... let's play some days and check again how you feel with that... + moar XP in strat - nice patch :D
hmm ... maybe half of angle between old and new setting?
yea.... 2h hero and he change 1h.... kurwa mac.... i love admins who never play on 1h but they nerf this because they "think" it is good....
Tydeus pls stay on 2h and fu** of from 1h if you dont know how change this mod...
Yes. Because shields were weak...they needed buffs.
WHAT FUCKING DREAMWORLD DOES TYDEUS SMOKE IN FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK
The fuck did you want him to do? Strategus is damn near dead on both sides of the pond and the only real significant change was the 1h right-swing animation.
The fuck did you want him to do, really? Even if he fucks shit up every now and again, at least someone that is knowledgeable about coding animations and whatnot is working on the mod. If he wasn't doing what he could, nobody would.
I don't mean to suck tydouche's dick or anything. He is far from perfect, but neither you nor I have the skillset to change anything. Give him helpful criticism, but don't just talk shit. It helps nothing.
Fips: Map updates, added:bariyye, blue_forest, burning_of_the_witch, ice_age, prison_riot, ruIn, viking_village_siege
More invisible walls woot
Tydeus: Lowered Valour threshold from 3x average to 2.8x. Increased minimum players required to 8.
Meaningless threshold change combined with a GUARANTEE of instant server death when reaching 7 players or less
Tydeus: Increased Score Offset cap from 1.25 to 1.5
meh
Tydeus: Increase Siege Shield HP
This needed in 2012
Fips: Maps Added: Bragelon Castle, Bridge of Eldia, Grey Havens(DTV)
Noone cares, noone plays DTV, make a SINGLE reasonable gamemode for EVERYONE already FFS
Tydeus: Dragging an overhead into a player, late in the animation, will now result in zero damage.
Yes lets just destroy the last chance for anyone to have reasonable chance of fighting with the 'bastard' weapons (fighting axe, bastard swords, longsword, morningstar, langesmesser etc in 1handed mode
Tydeus: Minor adjustment to the weapon's angle in the 1h right swing animation.
Yes, because THAT was a problem that needed fixing... the nice looking and effective rightswing for 1handers...
Tydeus: Increased XP in strategus a lot (base and the equipment rate)
Yes, once strat is dead in all but name make changes to it
Fips: Maps: Added Rivendell, Irongron Castle
We dont play siege or strar fips we dont care
FOR FUCKS SAKE TYDEUS STOP
Looney Toons Axe is back!
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but with -13 damage
Did some damage tests by dueling someone with 18/24, +3 throwing spears, 3 athletics, and medium armour. Was not expecting to duel anyone, but it happened when I was trying to damage test against donkeys.
The opponent had 59 body and head armour (was using topfhelm, strange armour, and heavy gauntlets). This wasn't an isolated test from him standing still, he was actively dodging and trying to kill me.
http://imgur.com/m8yiXAe,Vol83cU,uKNJlXh(click to show/hide)
The raw damage I have from standing still is 68. The large damages were from damage testing on a donkey. Small damages were from me nudging him or trying to attack in melee mode and glancing.
Things to note:
-raw damage was consistent, mostly positive even though I was backing away as he approached on most shots
-raw damage was consistent, but final damage shown resulted in quite the variance
-variance in damage was highly reliant on limb penalties. raw damage 70+hit location 1 (chest?) = 27, the normal expected damage. Locations 7-8 seems to be the shoulders. Raw damage 80 on location 7 dealt 23 raw damage.
-Headshot damage (location 9) still dealt very high amounts of damage. 38p, 6PT on one of the heavier helmets net me 74 final damage. Headshot damage is something like 2.2-2.5x damage. A 27 damage hit would have still dealt ~60 damage at least.
Conclusion: Accuracy is very important. Making sure you don't hit limbs results in consistently high damage. Not to say that throwing doesn't need any buffs, but giving them better accuracy for close ranged shots is a move in the right direction. If a damage increase is needed as well, it doesn't need that much for pierce damage (but is desperately needed for cut damage).
Fips: Map updates, added:bariyye, blue_forest, burning_of_the_ships, ice_age, prison_riot, ruIn, viking_village_siegeMore invisible walls wootnope
Tydeus: Lowered Valour threshold from 3x average to 2.8x. Increased minimum players required to 8.Meaningless threshold change combined with a GUARANTEE of instant server death when reaching 7 players or lessThe game is not about who can get valour.
Tydeus: Increased Score Offset cap from 1.25 to 1.5
meh
Tydeus: Increase Siege Shield HP
This needed in 2012
Fips: Maps Added: Bragelon Castle, Bridge of Eldia, Grey Havens(DTV)Noone cares, noone plays DTV, make a SINGLE reasonable gamemode for EVERYONE already FFSEU DTV is frequently full.
Tydeus: Dragging an overhead into a player, late in the animation, will now result in zero damage.Yes lets just destroy the last chance for anyone to have reasonable chance of fighting with the 'bastard' weapons (fighting axe, bastard swords, longsword, morningstar, langesmesser etc in 1handed mode
This has been a long time coming. I've had so many deaths from this bs.
Tydeus: Minor adjustment to the weapon's angle in the 1h right swing animation.Yes, because THAT was a problem that needed fixing... the nice looking and effective rightswing for 1handers...
Meh. I don't feel like it changed that much. Gives me something new to work on and it's nice seeing a dev still trying to improve the gameplay.
Tydeus: Increased XP in strategus a lot (base and the equipment rate)Yes, once strat is dead in all but name make changes to itI still see battles going on, so I guess it's not dead.
Fips: Maps: Added Rivendell, Irongron CastleWe dont play siege or strar fips we dont careI have seen EU2 have as many players as NA1 during prime time. Siege gets played.
FOR FUCKS SAKE TYDEUS STOP
Tydeus: Minor adjustment to the weapon's angle in the 1h right swing animation.
2h could get its swing animation sweetspots tweaked just a little to make it harder to hit with bad angles, but other than that nothing really needs to be nerfed about twohanders.Oh you silly kangaroo. Thinking people are smart enough to think before they rage.
PS: also, do you people not read the patchnotes? Pierce throwing didn't get buffed. Its melee mode did.
The fuck did you want him to do? Strategus is damn near dead on both sides of the pond and the only real significant change was the 1h right-swing animation.
The fuck did you want him to do, really? Even if he fucks shit up every now and again, at least someone that is knowledgeable about coding animations and whatnot is working on the mod. If he wasn't doing what he could, nobody would.
I don't mean to suck tydouche's dick or anything. He is far from perfect, but neither you nor I have the skillset to change anything. Give him helpful criticism, but don't just talk shit. It helps nothing.
to be honest there is no real need for new animations after 4 years....
The "deliberately miss overhead then drag around on the ground for full damage" mechanic was becoming commonly exploited and was the most infuriating aspect of melee combat for many players, so that was a much needed fix. This can't be understated.
The smaller sideswing sweetspots a few patches ago seriously cut down on "hiltslashing", at least against anyone with decent armor. Hiltslashing was another rage-inducing mechanic that offered high reward for no risk, and the fix seriously improved gameplay. This 1h right swing change wasn't really a big issue for anyone, but I doubt Tydeus spent too much time on it either.
The last remaining major melee combat annoyance is probably stab wonkiness, but at least all three weapon types have equally-exploitable stabs. I don't think they will ever "fix" this given Warband's engine limitations, but it looks like Tydeus will keep trying (see latest pole stab change).
My biggest concern is that the current devs/balancers will get too bogged down in a never-ending quest to fix these melee idiosyncrasies, when the two biggest issues threatening the life of the mod are 1. the game modes are broken and 2. the reward system sucks. Battle puts you at the mercy of the crappy autobalance system, siege is always empty, and DTV is boring and siphons players away from siege (where they'd usually rather be, but it's empty and DTV is better XP anyway). The multi/valor reward system is a poor fit for both battle and siege.
The "deliberately miss overhead then drag around on the ground for full damage" mechanic was becoming commonly exploited and was the most infuriating aspect of melee combat for many players, so that was a much needed fix. This can't be understated.NEW ANIMATIONS FFS
The smaller sideswing sweetspots a few patches ago seriously cut down on "hiltslashing", at least against anyone with decent armor. Hiltslashing was another rage-inducing mechanic that offered high reward for no risk, and the fix seriously improved gameplay. This 1h right swing change wasn't really a big issue for anyone, but I doubt Tydeus spent too much time on it either.
The last remaining major melee combat annoyance is probably stab wonkiness, but at least all three weapon types have equally-exploitable stabs. I don't think they will ever "fix" this given Warband's engine limitations, but it looks like Tydeus will keep trying (see latest pole stab change).
My biggest concern is that the current devs/balancers will get too bogged down in a never-ending quest to fix these melee idiosyncrasies, when the two biggest issues threatening the life of the mod are 1. the game modes are broken and 2. the reward system sucks. Battle puts you at the mercy of the crappy autobalance system, siege is always empty, and DTV is boring and siphons players away from siege (where they'd usually rather be, but it's empty and DTV is better XP anyway). The multi/valor reward system is a poor fit for both battle and siege.
Seems too easy to hit at bad angles though. I can see someone tearing up a group with a high cut and fast weapon by being able to indiscriminately spam left and right swings for full damage at anyone around him. Hits hard at close and long range, easy to aim at the head, damage winds up really quickly.
I hated how old right swing had basically a deadzone during its wind up and felt like you were a weakling who would break your arm swinging any weapon. So I like the change, but fear it will become extremely abusable once people adjust.
The "deliberately miss overhead then drag around on the ground for full damage" mechanic was becoming commonly exploited and was the most infuriating aspect of melee combat for many players, so that was a much needed fix. This can't be understated.
The smaller sideswing sweetspots a few patches ago seriously cut down on "hiltslashing", at least against anyone with decent armor. Hiltslashing was another rage-inducing mechanic that offered high reward for no risk, and the fix seriously improved gameplay. This 1h right swing change wasn't really a big issue for anyone, but I doubt Tydeus spent too much time on it either.
The last remaining major melee combat annoyance is probably stab wonkiness, but at least all three weapon types have equally-exploitable stabs. I don't think they will ever "fix" this given Warband's engine limitations, but it looks like Tydeus will keep trying (see latest pole stab change).
My biggest concern is that the current devs/balancers will get too bogged down in a never-ending quest to fix these melee idiosyncrasies, when the two biggest issues threatening the life of the mod are 1. the game modes are broken and 2. the reward system sucks. Battle puts you at the mercy of the crappy autobalance system, siege is always empty, and DTV is boring and siphons players away from siege (where they'd usually rather be, but it's empty and DTV is better XP anyway). The multi/valor reward system is a poor fit for both battle and siege.
What game are you playing?Such a well-made pile of shit you've just put here.
Or, and I really dont mean offence by this, you are playing NA, and honestly, if you guys in NA want to make a different game with Tydeus doing the balancing please do, but your dreams dont affect us.
A few quickies just to explain why I ask what game you are playing:
Siege is very popular. 2h stabs are still abused beyond belief. Shields were overbuffed last patch then....received another buff. Polearm mode axes were already godlike and abused regularly by those that knew how, and then.... buffed. 2-d polearms were already nerfed and unusable for most players, so they got nerfed again, making the majority of them completely vanish from the battlefield. 1h swords were always godlike... yeah buff them. Slow joke weapons such as 2h weapon in 1handed mode or a maul (not great or long just maul) were hard to use and their saving grace was being able to drag to catch agimy old friends: removed their ability to fight back. Throwing was strong, especially if you used non-melee hybrid throwing stuff: buff throws....
It's honestly, I'm not even kidding, it IS and HAS to be that Tydeus is simply playing a different game to me... So please NA my old friends, STOP playing this game, you have no martial history from this era, you (the nation) has never had to fight a war on even or underdog terms, you dont know what a struggle is. I dont WANT anyone to be excluded but if you blinkered bastards continue to change the world without having looked upon it, you run the risk of becoming (in this community) the same as in real life: Viewed with disdain by the entire world for your lack of understanding in the workings of anything. Shame on ANY of you for defending Tydeus' actions. Shame.
My biggest concern is that the current devs/balancers will get too bogged down in a never-ending quest to fix these melee idiosyncrasies, when the two biggest issues threatening the life of the mod are 1. the game modes are broken and 2. the reward system sucks. Battle puts you at the mercy of the crappy autobalance system, siege is always empty, and DTV is boring and siphons players away from siege or battle (where they'd usually rather be, but it's empty and DTV is better XP anyway). The multi/valor reward system is a poor fit for both battle and siege.
You (the nation) has never had to fight a war on even or underdog terms, you dont know what a struggle is.
So please NA my old friends, STOP playing this game, you have no martial history from this era, you (the nation) has never had to fight a war on even or underdog terms, you dont know what a struggle is. I dont WANT anyone to be excluded but if you blinkered bastards continue to change the world without having looked upon it, you run the risk of becoming (in this community) the same as in real life: Viewed with disdain by the entire world for your lack of understanding in the workings of anything. Shame on ANY of you for defending Tydeus' actions. Shame.
Only if you stop using your USA designed computer chips to post on the USA created internet writing in the USA language. Perhaps you could try one of the many USA made TV shows, movies, songs, or games you have on your USA Netflix Streaming, USA Google/Apple Smartphone, or USA Steam Gaming Account?
Only if you stop using your USA designed computer chips to post on the USA created internet writing in the USA language. Perhaps you could try one of the many USA made TV shows, movies, songs, or games you have on your USA Netflix Streaming, USA Google/Apple Smartphone, or USA Steam Gaming Account?
USA language :lol:
Only if you stop using your USA designed computer chips to post on the USA created internet writing in the USA language. Perhaps you could try one of the many USA made TV shows, movies, songs, or games you have on your USA Netflix Streaming, USA Google/Apple Smartphone, or USA Steam Gaming Account?
chadz
Considering my father is from a generation where he was in the fields picking cotton, the "struggle" is too close for comfort for me, thank-you very much.
What game are you playing?
Or, and I really dont mean offence by this, you are playing NA, and honestly, if you guys in NA want to make a different game with Tydeus doing the balancing please do, but your dreams dont affect us.
It's honestly, I'm not even kidding, it IS and HAS to be that Tydeus is simply playing a different game to me... So please NA my old friends, STOP playing this game, you have no martial history from this era, you (the nation) has never had to fight a war on even or underdog terms, you dont know what a struggle is. I dont WANT anyone to be excluded but if you blinkered bastards continue to change the world without having looked upon it, you run the risk of becoming (in this community) the same as in real life: Viewed with disdain by the entire world for your lack of understanding in the workings of anything. Shame on ANY of you for defending Tydeus' actions. Shame.
Considering my father is from a generation where he was in the fields picking cotton, the "struggle" is too close for comfort for me, thank-you very much.
no waaaay, you're the first black guy i've heard of playing crpg apart from myself
USA designed computer chipsIntegrated circuits, like so many other inventions, were an international collaboration. German, British and American.
double quote for freedom
also
only if you stop using letters invented by Yurop ! And numbers invented by arabs ! They gave you numbers you used them to create computers and stuff and you gave them back Tomahawks !!! SHAME !!
This is so racist, assuming he's black because his father picked cotton.
This is so racist, assuming he's black because his father picked cotton.
Plz stop buffing/nerfring weapons and fix the autobalance for next patch.
It wasn't a racist assumption. It was when he was like 5, too. He's a senior engineer at a technology company, so there's no offense to be taken even if you tried. :) They're just messing with you, Corsair.
firstly, i'm also black so it's not racist
This is seriously racist though. Black people can't be racist, because they are black ?You also forgot the fact that corsair isn't actually black :)
You also forgot the fact that corsair isn't actually black :)
A major clan had a big banner stack going, and it perpetually put the top-performing players that weren't in that clan on the same team as the banner stack, so they just kept winning.Sounds like your problem is not being a top-performing player
Sounds like your problem is not being a top-performing player
Jokes aside, with lowering player count and increasing blocking skill, thus increased strength of ganks, a good team balancer is absolutely essential to the enjoyability of this game. Banner groups should weigh heavily, an equal division of classes should be taken into account, an unequal division of players should be a possiblity etc. Now, I have looked at the code and it looks like a seriously convoluted mess. Perhaps throwing it all away and starting from scratch might be a good idea? Perhaps the overlords can be persuaded to help out, or at least give some advice? Just saying, this shit is rather important.
When I was against the banner stack, I sure felt like a crappy player, getting roflstomped every round. Then the rounds I was balanced with the banner stack, I suddenly was getting kills/valor all over the place.
I didn't magically get better just because I got balanced to the good team, it's just easier to do well when all the best players are on your team.
Sounds like your problem is not being a top-performing player
Jokes aside, with lowering player count and increasing blocking skill, thus increased strength of ganks, a good team balancer is absolutely essential to the enjoyability of this game. Banner groups should weigh heavily, an equal division of classes should be taken into account, an unequal division of players should be a possiblity etc. Now, I have looked at the code and it looks like a seriously convoluted mess. Perhaps throwing it all away and starting from scratch might be a good idea? Perhaps the overlords can be persuaded to help out, or at least give some advice? Just saying, this shit is rather important.
When I was against the banner stack, I sure felt like a crappy player, getting roflstomped every round. Then the rounds I was balanced with the banner stack, I suddenly was getting kills/valor all over the place.
I didn't magically get better just because I got balanced to the good team, it's just easier to do well when all the best players are on your team.
Sounds like your problem is not being a top-performing player
Jokes aside, with lowering player count and increasing blocking skill, thus increased strength of ganks, a good team balancer is absolutely essential to the enjoyability of this game. Banner groups should weigh heavily, an equal division of classes should be taken into account, an unequal division of players should be a possiblity etc. Now, I have looked at the code and it looks like a seriously convoluted mess. Perhaps throwing it all away and starting from scratch might be a good idea? Perhaps the overlords can be persuaded to help out, or at least give some advice? Just saying, this shit is rather important.
blocking skill is for noobs and duelmy old friends
real pro's use shields
only way too block 2 directions at the same time :D
about bannerstack though, i really don't get why people complain, i sort of do better playing with my clan mates sure, but most of the times the kill hungry assholes just steal all the kills
tbh i kinda prefer playing on the weaker team, rolling a map is just boring as hell for me
BUT i also want to play with my clan mates because it is fun.
i think the points based autobalance system crpg has is absolutely great tbh. works like a charm. like teeth said earlier, people just complain because they aren't winning, and i mean, just get better and stuff. (wear less armour, use shield, play native to get an idea how to actually block arrows, native clan matches to get an idea about teamwork, blah blah etc etc)
Actually, "getting good" is counter-productive if you don't get good inside the bannerstack. There is naught a more horrifying sight than me on top of my team's scoreboard with 20 Greys on the other side. If I had less points I would have a chance at being on the winning team. Of course, it's not always like that and in general it's a better idea to make your team win. But with bannerstacks the odds of winning are so far from balanced that's its better doing anything to get in the winning team rather than pointlessly trying to win.
Actually, "getting good" is counter-productive if you don't get good inside the bannerstack. There is naught a more horrifying sight than me on top of my team's scoreboard with 20 Greys on the other side. If I had less points I would have a chance at being on the winning team. Of course, it's not always like that and in general it's a better idea to make your team win. But with bannerstacks the odds of winning are so far from balanced that's its better doing anything to get in the winning team rather than pointlessly trying to win.
Tydeus: Dragging an overhead into a player, late in the animation, will now result in zero damage.What weapon? I can actually adjust further for each weapon type individually, it's just that testing itself isn't exactly easy for me to do.
Its gotten better but it still happens.. Anyhow, still nice improvement
Also the throwing equipment dmg increase is nice
What weapon? I can actually adjust further for each weapon type individually, it's just that testing itself isn't exactly easy for me to do.
What weapon? I can actually adjust further for each weapon type individually, it's just that testing itself isn't exactly easy for me to do.mostly 1hander overheads who tend to hit past their teammates and then hit me. But I think this is due to the turn rate with 1h is faster then the overhead animation can handle, or atleast that is what it looks like what is happening.
But with bannerstacks the odds of winning are so far from balanced that's its better doing anything to get in the winning team rather than pointlessly trying to win.
Do u really care so much about winning? On Eu1 one team with banner stack rolling on several maps in a row can be annyoing, that's true, but on Eu2? You can have as much fun in winning team as in a losing one. And xp, when you're already lvl 31+ a few xp more really makes that much difference?
Integrated circuits, like so many other inventions, were an international collaboration. German, British and American.
Nuh-uh.
Same validity for both our posts.
Not sure how head hitting, same reach, faster, and less glancing is worse to you. Just agree to disagree, then.
*dedicated short 1h player*
Did you see the preview for the altered animation? That's why I gave you those links again. Extract the brf into your resources and see if you like how that animation looks.
All I can say is that we simply have different experiences. I am still able to use right swing easily for weapon lengths from 75 to 88 with 0 adjustment to my playstyle. I was fighting another 1h and moved to an angle that would have glanced in the past, and he dealt ~7 damage, enough to stun. That's a step in the right direction imo. I agreed that Tydeus needed to edit it further to fix the unnatural look, which we will be able to experience the updated animation next patch and give more feedback if needed.
If you used right swing 2012 and earlier, that was pretty bad. Its only use was to punish whiffs (where you have to move into the attack/opponent kept moving forward after missing, not actually outranging in most cases). Any other usage only brought punishment by much faster attacks.
ok, i think i can explain this in background
i come originally from native, as does my playstyle. native playstyle is completely about spamming leftswing and target switching with the right swing. right swing target switch gets you up to half your kills, and the original range of it is perfect.
in crpg, hardly anyone knows how to do this, the majority of people either use
ridiculously long swords AKA nordic champion sword, etc etc (these compensate for the lack of a player's ability to use range well, but IMO aren't as effective; pre change that is)
or really short weapons, AKA maces, steel pick, etc etc, where right swing target switching isn't really an option because the weapon is so short. with this playstyle, you simply facehug and spam all directions.
the problem is, as i stated in my earlier post, it's not the guys using short weapons, who simply spam all of the attacks, and it's not the guys using nordic champion swords, who already have insanely long swords (and probably benefit from the animation making them shorter), who suffer; it is the guys like myself, trying to use actual mid-tier 1h, which have been completely ruined by this animation.
i'm not joking when i tell you i can't target switch any more, and my ability to out-range longswords etc is Ruined.
this affects my playstyle so hard, wheras before i could put longsword spamming nabs on the back foot, now they're free to kite me with impunity; i have no say on the weapon range situation, it's just so bad.
change it back pls.
If you used right swing 2012 and earlier, that was pretty bad. Its only use was to punish whiffs (where you have to move into the attack/opponent kept moving forward after missing, not actually outranging in most cases). Any other usage only brought punishment by much faster attacks.I loved the rightswing in 2012 and earlier as a 102 length 1h gives you enough reach on the rightswing to 'outrange' 120 length 2h sideswings. When I say outrange I mean bait them into thinking they can outreach you and then through careful timing and movement hit them in the face just before they do. Simply because most shielders can RMB themselves into close range and start ye old leftswing procedure, I think the old 1h right swing wasn't used to its full potential by a vast majority of the playerbase, which might have caused people to constantly underestimate the reach constantly. I played more 1h without shield than with, which quickly teaches you what utility the right swing offers you. I remember me and Bjord being pretty much the only 1h without shields and our duels consisted almost exclusively out of wiggling right swings at eachother, working on our range control.
I tested the old right swing reach against dummies back in 2013 when it was first changed, and tested it again for the altered animation. I later looked at the animation brf files themselves and saw no reach difference. That's the basis for my conclusions as well as from playing in-game.
I believe that the slowness allowed better movement into swings at the cost of more precise release timing as I believe Teeth is describing. What I am trying to get at is that requiring different timing doesn't mean the length extension itself was shortened. In general, I'm neutral on the new right swing since it hardly changed anything for me. I would just like it to have a more natural look.
am i the only person in this game who's class it's completely ruined?! does no one else play a medium shielder build with a medium sword?!
maybe i should go join the rest of the guys plate and strength crutching 1h with incredibly long 1h, or the other half spamming with short weapons
---"cRPG, coming that little bit closer to forcing everyone play the same build with each patch"---
am i the only person in this game who's class it's completely ruined?! does no one else play a medium shielder build with a medium sword?!Yes, you are the only person who's class gets ruined by this change as you are also the only person who is so resistant to any changes to Native mechanics that you refuse to even attempt to adapt. Obviously Native is the epitome of game design and the way you play is the epitome of skillful play.
maybe i should go join the rest of the guys plate and strength crutching 1h with incredibly long 1h, or the other half spamming with short weapons
---"cRPG, coming that little bit closer to forcing everyone play the same build with each patch"---
95 length is medium?
After playing on my 1h and focusing on maximizing my reach I do feel it is the same length. Hit a good lot of unsuspecting twohanders in the face and got some phantom reach complaints, just like with the old rightswing. With most animations hitting earlier in the arc allows you to hit faster without much loss of reach, if you unlearn that habit with the 1h rightswing it is long as hell. Still think the angle looks a bit awkward, but as far as I could see the revised animation addresses exactly that.
Yes, you are the only person who's class gets ruined by this change as you are also the only person who is so resistant to any changes to Native mechanics that you refuse to even attempt to adapt. Obviously Native is the epitome of game design and the way you play is the epitome of skillful play.
I also don't see why using a 95 reach sword makes you get hurt by a range reduction more than a 102 length sword. Slightly lower reach on the 102 swords would mean that you can no longer sensible contend with 120 length 2h and 140 length polearm swings, while you could before. Like 50% of the melee in EU use a weapon close to those values, so the change in people who's range bitch you are is a lot bigger for the 102 length swords, as it would be quite daft to try to outreach a Danish with a 95 reach sword pre-patch.
Yep, and if the animation would have been shorter a 102 reach sword would no longer be able to contend with Greatswords and Poleaxes. Same thing, except there are probably a lot more Greatswords and Poleaxes on EU 1.
i can make shortsword overhead bounce groundBy facing a hill? :|
Yep, and if the animation would have been shorter a 102 reach sword would no longer be able to contend with Greatswords and Poleaxes. Same thing, except there are probably a lot more Greatswords and Poleaxes on EU 1.
no.. simply look down when swing... :|It makes no difference for overheads whether you look up or down.
That's only if you completely outplay the GS or poleaxe user. In general, even longsword users can easily outreach 102 length 1h on sideswings if they have the same movement speed. The longsword has 3 points more speed, which also helps. At equal skill level, trying to do fancy squaredancing with a reach disadvantage is going to get you killed more often.Longsword swings are significantly shorter than a 102 length 1h right swing. The difference between the 1h rightswing and a Danish isn't all that big either. It definitely is small enough for me to comfortably try my hand at the reach game when facing these weapons. Many 'good' Greatword and Poleaxe users are still quite sloppy or lazy with their reach control and if you have practiced with the right swing a little they are fairly easy to outplay.
It makes no difference for overheads whether you look up or down.
Longsword swings are significantly shorter than a 102 length 1h right swing.
The difference between the 1h rightswing and a Danish isn't all that big either. It definitely is small enough for me to comfortably try my hand at the reach game when facing these weapons. Many 'good' Greatword and Poleaxe users are still quite sloppy or lazy with their reach control and if you have practiced with the right swing a little they are fairly easy to outplay.
I don't feel like that to be honest. I almost never let onehanders get the overture attack when I play longsword, unless they are moving ridiculously fast. And it's not like my 2h alt has that much movement speed, with 18 agi and 18kg of body armor. I like to throw stab feints in the mix though, which are definitely longer than their right swings.
We can agree that "outreaching" most weapons is possible with 100+ 1h shieldless, but to be honest it's often not worth it. On top of that if they stab you are screwed, cause that will connect first no matter what you do.
Unless you are using a 3d 1h, why is anyone trying to outreach 2h users with a right swing? Stab is faster, has more reach, and usually does more damage. Right swing is a good way to mix it up if they are blocking your stabs, but usually 2h users' hubris makes them think they can just spam sideswings at max range (without having to block) when facing a 1h user. I stab these guys all day until they get wise and play more defensively.
I'm always amazed how many 2h users refuse to accept that they may have to block first when fighting a 1h. Sometimes I get unlucky and my stab glances while their sideswing connects, but that's rare. I'll even try to open with a stab against longsword users holding a stab (although that's only a 50/50 proposition) but at least my stab does more damage than theirs.
As strange as it sounds, 1h animations are actually better set up for max-range dancing than 2h. 2h performs much better in facehug range though. Totally backwards, but that's Warband.
First, stabs stopped outreaching right swings when Tydeus fucked up the stab sweetspot curve. Unless you are hitting a naked guy, of course.
Unless you are using a 3d 1h, why is anyone trying to outreach 2h users with a right swing? Stab is faster, has more reach, and usually does more damage. Right swing is a good way to mix it up if they are blocking your stabs, but usually 2h users' hubris makes them think they can just spam sideswings at max range (without having to block) when facing a 1h user. I stab these guys all day until they get wise and play more defensively.No words on these forums have been any more true than this.
I'm always amazed how many 2h users refuse to accept that they may have to block first when fighting a 1h. Sometimes I get unlucky and my stab glances while their sideswing connects, but that's rare. I'll even try to open with a stab against longsword users holding a stab (although that's only a 50/50 proposition) but at least my stab does more damage than theirs.
As strange as it sounds, 1h animations are actually better set up for max-range dancing than 2h. 2h performs much better in facehug range though. Totally backwards, but that's Warband.
Unless you are using a 3d 1h, why is anyone trying to outreach 2h users with a right swing? Stab is faster, has more reach, and usually does more damage. Right swing is a good way to mix it up if they are blocking your stabs, but usually 2h users' hubris makes them think they can just spam sideswings at max range (without having to block) when facing a 1h user. I stab these guys all day until they get wise and play more defensively.
I'm always amazed how many 2h users refuse to accept that they may have to block first when fighting a 1h. Sometimes I get unlucky and my stab glances while their sideswing connects, but that's rare. I'll even try to open with a stab against longsword users holding a stab (although that's only a 50/50 proposition) but at least my stab does more damage than theirs.
As strange as it sounds, 1h animations are actually better set up for max-range dancing than 2h. 2h performs much better in facehug range though. Totally backwards, but that's Warband.
the (old) right swing can be harder to block if you know what you're doing
stab is so easy to see it's rarely worth doing it as an out-ranging technique
Throw in a quick 360 or 180 before every stab and you'll see it hit a lot more.
against someone who's incredibly bad, sure, but against someone who has half a clue what they're doing not a chance in hell
Even the best players usually fall victim to the "surprise target switch". It doesn't work in duels obviously, but it's pretty much the only effective way to kill a pro blocker in battle/siege.
The only effective way to kill a good player is ranged.Implying there's no good shielder players? Wow so racist.
Implying there's no good shielder players? Wow so racist.
The only effective way to kill a good player is ranged.
Throw in a quick 360 or 180 before every stab and you'll see it hit a lot more.