cRPG
cRPG => Beginner's Help and Guides => Topic started by: Normanguy on February 11, 2014, 07:18:41 pm
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Hello all,
Just wanted to ask if anyone could post some good builds for pole arm hoplite with 1h
And also which 1 handed weapons are best to use as a side arm for when not using the war spear
Thanks
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Here's a general outline that will get you started thinking about your build... a lot is going to depend upon your playstyle, and what you want the character to do (and the level you want to reach. I'm assuming 30?).
I'm guessing that the 1H backup means you want to be frontline tank.
In this case, a build with minimal conversions sounds best so that you can have high IF and Shield to hold the line:
21/15 - Having only 5 WM to split between 2 weapon types strikes me as pretty blah (you can just barely get both over 100 WPF). Plus only 5 ATH... ugh.
15/21 - 5 PS sounds really frustrating when you don't have a boatload of AGI to make up the difference with speed bonus.
18/18 - Balanced. Your ATH/PS won't be 7s, but they also won't be 5s. Enough WPF to split moderately well (123/125 or 139/101 depending on which you favor), and enough HP (65) to keep you alive on the front line. Worst case, it's a 'neutral base' that you can adjust the following gen if you decide you want to hit a little bit harder or be a half step quicker.
As for backup weapons, again it's going to come down to playstyle (and your WPF distribution). Are you:
-Spear-Heavy: You are a hoplite who primarily uses the spear and only switches to the 1H backup as a last resort.
-Balanced: You are a hoplite who switches back and forth between weapons as the situation dictates.
-Sword-Heavy:You are effectively a 1H shielder who happens to carry a spear to get a few pokes in before switching to 1H
In any case, you'll want your backup weapon to be on the short-side (your spear is here for reach-fights, your backup is for facehug fights).
You may even want to have a couple of weapons in your inventory so you can spawn with the right 'tool' depending on the enemy team's makeup.
Lots of shielders? Bring an axe.
Lots of plate? Bring a steel pick.
General mix? Bring a short sword.
(A mace class weapon strikes me as a bit too heavy for a backup).
As always, the only thing that really matters is whether or not the build is fun to play and feels rewarding. This should help get you started.
Cheers!
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Well cheers for that mate :D
My play style os very varied so can't marrow that down :)
I have myself a masterwork war spear currently and my 1h weapon is usually when i'm one against 3+
So a last resort.
So as for builds i am still a bit stuck as anything 15 is quote naf but i would prefer 18/21 or 21/18 preferably but again i am not sure if a hoplite need iron flesh and i would prefer my stats to contain more pole arm than one handed.
I am quite stuck, so anyone else's view will be most appreciated
Thanks :D
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15/21 - 5 PS sounds really frustrating when you don't have a boatload of AGI to make up the difference with speed bonus.
I understand where Johammeth is coming from. 5 PS sucks when fighting str heavy enemies.
I've been a hoplite awhile and I use 15/21 lvl 30 build. It's a good hoplite hybrid build with enough 1h to go along with polearm. Medium armor is the best for this build. As the gear, I recommend ashwood pike, Italian falchion, and elite cavalry shield. But you can choose whatever.
I know many good players that use 18/21, it's a good build with decent damage and decent agi.
Here is a guide made by a member of the community for hoplites:
http://forum.melee.org/guides/the-sword-and-spear-way-hoplites-guide/
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I recommend 21-18. You should consider skipping ironflesh if you have heirloomed armour. If you don't, ironflesh may be necessary.
Try the Spear for a hoplite weapon, and if you're using 1h as an emergency weapon only, consider dedicating only 50 wpf to 1h and the rest to polearm. I'd recommend a knockdown 1h weapon as well. It'll help if you're fighting multiple people. Spathovaklion is pretty much indisputable as the "best" 1h blunt weapon along with the warhammer, but I prefer the flanged mace for both style and decent function.
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I used 21/15 before the WPF patch, It was awesome, can't complain. Not sure about it with the new WPF patch, guess I have to try it again..
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Thanks guys has helped
Currently i am a level 29
And am 15/21 but the stab does suck a bit but is ok i guess so now i have a mw war spear so i think as you mention a good 1h blunt good work so thanks
Thanks
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get an ashwood pike, it has an amazing dmg
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Oh, I forgot something. It is obligatory for all classes to use something that most players call "the wiggle".
When you're attacking as a hoplite, you should look up above your enemy when you start your stab, and pull your mouse and view down while you are stabbing. It results in a much better chance of actually hitting the enemy with the stab and increased damage. You're also able to perform the same move using left to right or right to left. If you take two players with identical wpf, items, and build, the player that turns into their swings better will ALWAYS hit first.
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Yeah thanks mate i do that alot anyway :D
Was just the stats and build but thanks for the help all!!:D
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If you are using a war spear or other fast 4 direction polearm, try putting your shield away and using that weapon instead of switching to a 1H when you are fighting solo. They are plenty fast, good reach, and won't glance on walls unless you are fighting in a really tiny hallway.
Practicing manual blocks will improve your awareness and help you to be a better player even when you are using your shield.
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yeah know thanks for that
I'm fine qwith all general mechanics was just a build really and as I ahd a +3 1h weapon it hought I may as well put it to some use as I like shielding and the pole :)
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Which +3 1hander do you have? Ones with good thrust/weak swing aren't that great for hoplite builds. Your opponent will already be focusing on blocking thrusts, so a stabby 1H doesn't do much to change your attack style. If it's something really fast like a dagger, that doesn't matter as much. They require less WPF investment, and their short reach changes your attack style enough for stabs to be viable again.
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Thanks again i didn't think of that!!
I use
Mw war spear
Plate covered round shield
Mw military hammer
The hammer is quite slow but was wanting to get a spathovaklion but not sure wether to consider a 1h cut + pierce damage weapon as you say
Just not sure what to get
I could easily get a mw military pick or something
Which 1h weps would you suggest then?
Thanks
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Thanks again i didn't think of that!!
I use
Mw war spear
Plate covered round shield
Mw military hammer
The hammer is quite slow but was wanting to get a spathovaklion but not sure wether to consider a 1h cut + pierce damage weapon as you say
Just not sure what to get
I could easily get a mw military pick or something
Which 1h weps would you suggest then?
Thanks
What is your wpf in 1h, if it's less than 100, I would say going for something fast. If your wpf in 1h more that 100, chose whatever really. I prefer the Italian falchion or broad short sword.
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15/21
Grab short spear, a stabby spammy sword and a brown lion heater shield
Then enjoy the spam
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Thanks again i didn't think of that!!
I use
Mw war spear
Plate covered round shield
Mw military hammer
The hammer is quite slow but was wanting to get a spathovaklion but not sure wether to consider a 1h cut + pierce damage weapon as you say
Just not sure what to get
I could easily get a mw military pick or something
Which 1h weps would you suggest then?
Thanks
Spathovaklion is the best onehander for most builds. Go and get one!
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Do a generation without a sidearm, after that you can pick one up if you like. Helps you know when you really need to pull it out as opposed to taking it every 1v1 and spending less time using your spear.
War spear is too short versus other spears.
Spend more time attacking then you spend blocking. The more you attack, the less you block. The less you block, the longer your shield lasts.
Common shield doctrine: If you have a shield and you get hit, you are doing it wrong. Mentally review how you got hit and how you can avoid it next time. Mistakes are bad and if you get hit with your shield unbroken you most likely made one. Despite the above tip, you are a defensive class and you do not want to die. Dying is bad.
Don't try an kill people, try and stab them. Focusing on killing gives you tunnel vision, which is bad. You want to win the battle as a whole, so just poke whoever is not looking or downblocking.
If the guy in front of you is getting all uppity about you poking his teammates, but insists on holding his downblock, nudge him away and shift behind or to the side of a teammate and pick a new front buddy.
If fighting alone versus multiple people, rate them in order of aggression and pick the LEAST aggressive one as your front buddy. Move around to keep everyone behind your front buddy so you can poke them from over his(front buddy) shoulder.
Alternate front buddy's every now and then or they will catch on.
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cheers mate :)
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Try out one the cheaper 1H maces. They have less reach than the hammer does, but your 1H backup weapon is specifically for when you want a shorter weapon. You'll save some cash that way as well.
An axe helps alot in hoplite vs hoplite. That usually turns into a drawn out stalemate since it takes forever for someone's shield to break. But axes look ugly with hoplite gear!!! :evil:
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Try out one the cheaper 1H maces. They have less reach than the hammer does, but your 1H backup weapon is specifically for when you want a shorter weapon. You'll save some cash that way as well.
An axe helps alot in hoplite vs hoplite. That usually turns into a drawn out stalemate since it takes forever for someone's shield to break. But axes look ugly with hoplite gear!!! :evil:
We Norse disagree.
(Cheap and short handaxe does not poke outside shield. Not sure about others.)
Speaking of handaxe, that reminds me. WHEN you do start bringing sidearms (Remember I recommend a gen without) bring ALL the side arms. Fill out your slots. Spear + Shield = 3 slots / 2 squares. That leaves 1 slot 2 squares. I recommend a combination of 1 slot axe and dagger or 1 slot sword/mace and a handaxe (the stronger 0 slot 1 axe). I personally use a combination of 0 slot axe/dagger for style, or 1 slot axe / dagger for efficiency. (Shortswords are 0 slot, I use daggers because dagger kills are always a laugh...and they are fast and deadly if you still have your shield up)
Filling out your slots assures you have something for every situation and are never at a disadvantage.
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Thanks again!! :))
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Im 15/27 1h/pole hybrid with 190 wpf in pole and 118 in 1h lvl 34, as long as you have the spear masterworked 5 PS should be enough, but the 1h hits wimpy as fuck if i use a sword. A high damage axe or a blunt/pierce weapon will do the job though. Such as the military hammer (OP shit, hate it) steel pick or Iron war axe/Broad one handed battle axe. A stabby sword will do just fine though, but then its kind of relying on just the stabs.
If you decide to go agi based hoplite my advice as how to play it would be to spam a lot, people know you are a hoplite and hoplites tend to turtle once they get attacked, and so the enemy will find another target. So usually they block your first stab and then switch to another target but during this you launch another stab to interrupt them. With the mobility from all the agi you can often keep up with them, and sometimes dodge out of their reach when necessary.
Also try to time your stabs in order to keep an enemy locked blocking if you 2v1, dont just stab whenever you can.
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Thanks gravoth :)
Dont suppose you could message me an agi basses hoplite build with stats with or without 1h
For level 30
Not sure how to go
Thanks
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15/24 would be the lower level version of my build, 5 shield 5 wm 5 PS 8 athl. No IF is unfortunate but as a hoplite you can block most of the attacks and dodge the rest. ~150 wpf in pole if pure build which is good, 5 shield is enough as a hoplite you wont taking the front too much so shield doesnt get pummeled much. Also leaves lvl 31+ builds open, you can just max WM out on 31 and retire on 32.
Its kind of a different playstyle though depending on your previous builds, low PS means glancing if you dont wigglestab good etc. Takes practise ;) But the most fun build ive found, played it since 2011.
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thanks for that well my very first build was 15/21 and was ok just takes more hits as you say I may try that build thanks :D