cRPG
cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Topic started by: Corrado_Decimo on July 29, 2011, 11:20:46 am
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ok the real problem is that there are a lot of nerfs but not enough buffs. i'm playing crpg since august 2010 and in this long year, patches after patches, nerfs after nerfs, the game became really slow paced compared to what was a year ago. STR builds was slow but not so slow, agi builds was WAY faster, shielders were faster, ranged were faster.
the fast pace will really make 2handed and polearms an hardcore experience (now at actual game speed, manual blocking 2 opponents is not that hard). so i see this as a 2h/polearm nerf because will be harder to manual block with tightened reaction times.
and please don't troll with things like "then go play native". who will not like a faster game? or at least near as fast as native?
can't we at least set servers to fast combat speed instead rebalancing it?
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I disagree because of Strategus - we have a global game where NA and EU are playing together. If you make it faster you will have a very very hard time to block anything playing overseas.
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I disagree because of Strategus - we have a global game where NA and EU are playing together. If you make it faster you will have a very very hard time to block anything playing overseas.
THIS
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If you are referring to native where most NA servers have gamemode set to fastest - this was probably what killed native in north america.
No need to repeat that.
(more ping dependant, less skill dependant, spamming is more useful, etc etc)
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There is a problem, some duels can take 5 minutes, some 10 minutes if to play serious and сoncentrated. And thats not epic duels, thats really boring duels. Oponents do all tricks they can, but seems none of them getting tired. So some people try to exploit broken animation, some just risking using spam and chambers(me for example) to finish duel somehow faster. Faster game speed makes combat much more intersting and harder. Not just for 2h and manual blocking,for timing and shielders as well. Though strategus battles are laggy and dont need it. The harder way to make duels/group battles more faster and interesting is to add more elements in melee combat, so more things you need to keep in mind while fighting.(shield bashing for example)
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There is a problem, some duels can take 5 minutes, some 10 minutes if to play serious and сoncentrated. And thats not epic duels, thats really boring duels. Oponents do all tricks they can, but seems none of them getting tired. So some people try to exploit broken animation, some just risking using spam and chambers(me for example) to finish duel somehow faster. Faster game speed makes combat much more intersting and harder. Not just for 2h and manual blocking,for timing and shielders as well. Though strategus battles are laggy and dont need it. The harder way to make duels/group battles more faster and interesting is to add more elements in melee combat, so more things you need to keep in mind while fighting.(shield bashing for example)
this.
usually in the brawl, i meet some good blockers and we just keep blocking all the hits until i give up to go help somewherelse. same thing in duel servers. you engage in really long duels until one just start doing in-and-outs, chambers.
i agree anyway with the fact that with this speed the game is a little lesser ping dependant (but not that much less).
we'll anyway see more and more str builds because agi route is only worth the athletics since there isn't a lot of wpf difference from a pure STR build (120ish wpf) and a balanced or more agi oriented build (160-170wpf).
EDIT:
to counter this slow combat speed, people prefer doing 18/21 or 15/24 polearm builds to just stunlock you and iwin.
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I completely disagree.
No player I've met has had a defence that cannot be broken through, and while there has been some really long duels, I cannot say I haven't enjoyed them.
When two people of equal (and great) skill meet, the duel turns into more of a mindgame - and nothing wrong with that since out-smarting your opponent is, imo, as much a part of the game as being able to do 50 feints/sec to fool him.
If you want higher gamespeed, there are other servers, in other mods for that.
EDIT: Yes, polestun is fucking stupid, but that's already been said 1000 times
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Faster game speed helps spamming. I don't like long duels either, but that's mainly because I'm an agressive player. Endurance duels are fun too at times (goddamn perfect blockers with super poor attack skills) :D
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Hey, not everyone can play on a server where they get less than 60 ping :|
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This mod is not intended for duel, it's intended for large scale battles, remember Pub Crawl!!
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No player I've met has had a defence that cannot be broken through, and while there has been some really long duels, I cannot say I haven't enjoyed them.
I will take wooden stick and will just use blocks/attacks. You can take danish great sword and heavy armor, lets see how much fun u will get from such duel.
Endurance duels are fun too at times
Thats not fun when oponent wins by boredom.
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I completely disagree.
No player I've met has had a defence that cannot be broken through, and while there has been some really long duels, I cannot say I haven't enjoyed them.
When two people of equal (and great) skill meet, the duel turns into more of a mindgame - and nothing wrong with that since out-smarting your opponent is, imo, as much a part of the game as being able to do 50 feints/sec to fool him.
If you want higher gamespeed, there are other servers, in other mods for that.
EDIT: Yes, polestun is fucking stupid, but that's already been said 1000 times
is not ME that want higher gamespeed. is really a lot of people that want that AND it's a way to rebalance the fact that in a year, cRPG fighting speed slowly became what is now. slow.
and yes. when players with similar above average skill are fighting, they will just continue swing, block, feint, block, hold, block so on until the rest of the players kills each other. that's why usually a teamplay minded player will give up the duel and go help somewherelse leaving that skilled enemy blocker to do the same.
and about polestun, yes said 1000 times but people just retire and reroll polearms because they offer many fighting styles and roles plus the stunlock ability.
This mod is not intended for duel, it's intended for large scale battles, remember Pub Crawl!!
that's why i say that. now the average skill is so high that an average manual blocker can block anything besides facing phyrex, bjord, tempest, rubicon.
even i (average skilled die hard 2handed) can block a lot in 1vs1 and sometime even in 1vs2 when focusing on blocking.
not to mention that in siege servers, the running speed / fighting speed is even slower than battle.
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so average skill level is getting higher. you guys miss the ability to pwn everyone they meet in 5 seconds is that what this is?
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I miss duels based on footwork, reaction and tactic. Now it based on luck, ugly feints and facehugging dancing. This thread is not about pwning.
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Give them fastest speed on duel server, so they can have their super fast danish light saber duels there.
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I have to agree, after all the nerfs, nerfs and more nerfs it looks like the game is catered to old men with the reaction time of a sloth. Speeding it up slightly would make it more entertaining.
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I have to agree, after all the nerfs, nerfs and more nerfs it looks like the game is catered to old men with the reaction time of a sloth. Speeding it up slightly would make it more entertaining.
I don't want to have to bankrupt myself on Red Bull to be effective in melee.
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Well right now you're bankrupt on Marijuana trying to be effective. Well, that, ping, and some feinting with a dash of luck.
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Maybe it would help if you nerds wouldnt play this fucking videogame night and day. What about a girlfriend, a job or at least a different videogame?
crpg is mostly about gang-banging and back-stabbing. This, plus always darkness. And the ping issue. And the 2h/pole tincans that are superfast and still able to 1 shot kill. I am forced to play native on fastest speed, but its a lot slower (and therefore easier to parry) for me than crpg.
Also, I have never heard of those two wannabe pro na players who say they can defend themselves against a good player for 10 minutes, but Phyrex I have a simple question for you: Why do you play the easiest class then? Why dont you try another class after 3 years 2h? When you seek a new challenge?
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nerds wouldnt play this fucking videogame night and day.
I just lost all respect for you. Well, I didn't have much respect for you then, but now I think it goes into the negatives.
Back on topic, that doesn't have a shit of difference on why there are nerfs.
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Yea...
My post is out, 1 min later yours, says it all. Get a life kid.
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My post is out, 1 min later yours, says it all. Get a life kid.
Reply #18 on: Today at 12:54:33
Reply #19 on: Today at 12:56:04
Last Edit: Today at 12:59:04 by DrTaco
Reply #20 on: Today at 12:58:11
Look at your comment. Back to mine. Back to yours NOW BACK TO MINE. Sadly, it isnt mine. But if you stopped trolling and started posting legitimate crap it could LOOK like mine. Look down, back up, where are you? Youre scrolling through comments, finding the ones that your comment could look like. Back at mine, what is it? Its a highly effective counter-troll. Look again, MY COMMENT IS NOW DIAMONDS.Anything is possible when you think before you comment
im on a Desktop.
Seeing your post right after the edit goes through is fun ♥
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I have to agree, after all the nerfs, nerfs and more nerfs it looks like the game is catered to old men with the reaction time of a sloth. Speeding it up slightly would make it more entertaining.
Yep... the current cRPG gamespeed is yawn-worthy.
Making it faster (not necessarily by moving the actual gamespeed setting from normal to fast...) would make it better for all, IMO. Fights would last shorter, less skilled players would have a better chance against more skilled players (easier to screw up with faster weapon speeds etc), and you would actually have to be fast to block stuff... and stufff. Yes!
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Making the game faster would make the game stupider. If you want fast, make your own native server and set the speed to fast. Keep your bullshit "faster makes it easier" argument off my servers. I am a relatively casual 1h player, and I think it's perfect as it is. chadz already posted in this thread the reason why the speed is the way it is, so just leave it alone.
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Personally I agree that the average players skill has increased but I do not think speeding up the game speed will fix the problem of long duels. Granted that faster game speed means more people mess up faster but it will probably become a spam fest and those who have a longer weapon would win more, Im not going to say I have the perfect solution on how to fix this because I don't. The only thing I can think of to do about this is tweak some weapons and some other things or ask the veterans (Phyrex, Bjord, Siiem, Aki and the other so called heros) and see what they think would help solve this problem.
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Making the game faster would make the game stupider. If you want fast, make your own native server and set the speed to fast. Keep your bullshit "faster makes it easier" argument off my servers. I am a relatively casual 1h player, and I think it's perfect as it is. chadz already posted in this thread the reason why the speed is the way it is, so just leave it alone.
It's funny because the only bullshit argument comes from you. "omg makez ur own survar in nativ den!!" Clearly people want to play cRPG even if the gamespeed isn't ideal - since no one is threatening to GTX here. They just think it would be a better mod if it was slightly faster. Also, chadz was speaking about a different thing. Most if not all of the posters are speaking about WPF nerfs and the weapon speed nerfs making the game slower.
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Making the game faster would make the game stupider. If you want fast, make your own native server and set the speed to fast. Keep your bullshit "faster makes it easier" argument off my servers. I am a relatively casual 1h player, and I think it's perfect as it is. chadz already posted in this thread the reason why the speed is the way it is, so just leave it alone.
your servers? oh sorry then.... what if i say "we like a faster game so what about you all slow guys go play farmville?"
but...
you're worried for what? you just won't improve your skill like all below-average 1handers around that won't even put some effort in getting some manual block skills.
you just defend your own needs here since you gave no constructive opinion in your reply.
Maybe it would help if you nerds wouldnt play this fucking videogame night and day. What about a girlfriend, a job or at least a different videogame?
uhm i have a life. i have a work, a wife, a daughter, some debits, a house, i gig with a blues band and guess what? i even have some spare time to play cRPG. isn't a matter on how much you play. if you want a even slower game, there is a game like "chess". i just said that the game got slower and slower every patch. if cRPG continue like this, will be a turn-based war sim.
EDIT:
I don't want to have to bankrupt myself on Red Bull to be effective in melee.
no. a year ago cRPG was faster and nobody abused drugs, redbull, coke, metamphetamine. even on ndition's native duel, nobody relies on that to win. so... no.
maybe the coffee :wink:
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Don't speed it up, I hate native for that as it allows more spamming (real spam).
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Hmmm, what about just making Weaponmastery more worthwhile...?
Right now it hardly pays off to have a WM skill above 5 unless you're a hybrid.
If you were able to reach, say, 200 WPF as a dedicated something with a high Agi build would speed overall combat up and lessen the amounts of high Str build yet it wouldn't brake the game like setting the combat speed to "fastest".
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Hmmm, what about just making Weaponmastery more worthwhile...?
Right now it hardly pays off to have a WM skill above 5 unless you're a hybrid.
If you were able to reach, say, 200 WPF as a dedicated something with a high Agi build would speed overall combat up and lessen the amounts of high Str build yet it wouldn't brake the game like setting the combat speed to "fastest".
i agree. like it was in 2010. so cheaper wpf cost above 130 profiency or more WPP per WM. (but giving more wpp will just make more heavycrossbow / 2h hybrids)
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no. a year ago cRPG was faster and nobody abused drugs, redbull, coke, metamphetamine. even on ndition's native duel, nobody relies on that to win. so... no.
*Looks accusingly at Phyrex*
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I don't want fastest game speed because I don't live within a thousand miles of a cRPG server.
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isn't there a FAST game speed? Something between the medium we have now and Fastest?
Why not do a test run on that speed for a bit. I mean, IT IS a beta. Why not test a different speed and see if that speed hurts what's been done, or helps it. If it's not efficient then roll back to medium.
If you DO do a speed increase, don't tell anyone until afterwords. That way the complaints won't be premeditated. A lot of people complain that faster game will increase spam, so if stated ahead of time, then the spam complaints WILL increase. If not, then the likelihood of them increasing is minimal for the first day or two.
TL;DR
Ninja increase game speed to fast(if it's there, not fastest), test it for a few days and see the results.
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isn't there a FAST game speed? Something between the medium we have now and Fastest?
Why not do a test run on that speed for a bit. I mean, IT IS a beta. Why not test a different speed and see if that speed hurts what's been done, or helps it. If it's not efficient then roll back to medium.
If you DO do a speed increase, don't tell anyone until afterwords. That way the complaints won't be premeditated. A lot of people complain that faster game will increase spam, so if stated ahead of time, then the spam complaints WILL increase. If not, then the likelihood of them increasing is minimal for the first day or two.
TL;DR
Ninja increase game speed to fast(if it's there, not fastest), test it for a few days and see the results.
best reply so far.
and i agree about ninjas being more valuable and funny to play.
if i'm not wrong, when pecores did the old EU_4 200 slots battle server, the game speed was set to FAST. so i think it's possible to do again.
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Setting the game to fastest or whatever would be retarded. I'd rather see WFP curve increase or weapon speed buff.
Spamming in Native? Good luck doing that Vs any half-decent Native player or perhaps you were only fighting noobs? Or was it you getting spammed?
I thought the Ninjas with 220+ wfp with 27+ Agi, wfp retirement bonus and MW Katanas at 104 speed or whatever they had was retarded at first, but quite fast I got used to the speed they had and had no trouble duelling them. Infact my most cheerised moments were when I duelled Khorin with both having 200+ wfp and MW katanas, it was awesome.
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Setting the game to fastest or whatever would be retarded. I'd rather see WFP curve increase or weapon speed buff.
Spamming in Native? Good luck doing that Vs any half-decent Native player or perhaps you were only fighting noobs? Or was it you getting spammed?
I thought the Ninjas with 220+ wfp with 27+ Agi, wfp retirement bonus and MW Katanas at 104 speed or whatever they had was retarded at first, but quite fast I got used to the speed they had and had no trouble duelling them. Infact my most cheerised moments were when I duelled Khorin with both having 200+ wfp and MW katanas, it was awesome.
and we'll see maybe some awlpikes... even bastard swords and such instead seeing only LHB, scythes, GLA, poleaxes, claymores and german/danish.
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Plz no faster game speed. I already suck at current speed :mrgreen:
Also think about the not so skilled players at cRPG (yeah I know they (including myself!) suck, so why care about them :rolleyes:)
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Plz no faster game speed. I already suck at current speed :mrgreen:
Also think about the not so skilled players at cRPG (yeah I know they suck, so why care about them :rolleyes:)
they'll (we :rolleyes:) suck anyway.
but that's not a good reason to have a even more slower game if the balance roadmap follow the previous nerf fashion. some buff instead of nerf would be nice.
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If you are referring to native where most NA servers have gamemode set to fastest - this was probably what killed native in north america.
The only reason I play native is for fastest duel servers. Yes, it's more ping-dependent, yes, it makes spamming more viable for the average player, but I think it's even more skill dependent. The skill gradient is much higher for fastest game speed, and spamming doesn't work when you start dueling skilled players. Plus it's a lot more fun!
I can totally understanding not wanting a huge skill gradient in normal play, and NA vs. EU strat battles would be even more of a nightmare, but I think there's a sizeable portion of the community who would love a fastest duel server at the very least. Just one fastest duel server would allow many of the more skilled players to test their mettle in a more competitive environment.
It wouldn't even have to be an official server. I asked Ecko if he would turn his duel server into a fastest duel server, and he said he would, except that c-rpg overwrites speed settings. You could keep both medium and fastest duel servers and let players pick which ones they prefer.
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Well, before the last speed nerf, at 80 ping, it was near impossible to block a high agi player with a katana, if he feinted. I somehow do not miss those times.
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A slower speed then what we have now would be better, that way I just might learn how to do chamber blocking on demand.
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i´d love to have higher speeds back. infact, i´d love to have most of the OPness back (pness ^^) that i encountered when i began playing crpg last year.
but, i usually have about 20 ping, so meh.
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A slower speed then what we have now would be better, that way I just might learn how to do chamber blocking on demand.
well get a clanmember as a sparring partner with wooden swords. this game really don't deserve to be slower than it is.
we need some kind of buff to the profiency points. to all the weapon classes.
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well get a clanmember as a sparring partner with wooden swords. this game really don't deserve to be slower than it is.
we need some kind of buff to the profiency points. to all the weapon classes.
No, unless it was a slight buff as otherwisw wed beback in the good ol days with super fast players with 200 wpf,
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This mod isn't meant to cater exclusively to 2h pros making 200 mph spins with their over-compensating super swords.
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This mod isn't meant to cater exclusively to 2h pros making 200 mph spins with their over-compensating super swords.
I sense ur a 1 hander.
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Go agi build, you can get very fast. The game only feels slow because everyone is going STR now.
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Actually I don't play cRPG.
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Actually I don't play cRPG.
Stopped playing or never did?
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If you are referring to native where most NA servers have gamemode set to fastest - this was probably what killed native in north america.
No need to repeat that.
(more ping dependant, less skill dependant, spamming is more useful, etc etc)
Truer words have never been spoken.
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Phyrex and the rest of the guys with better reflexes will own me more - but nevertheless, cRPG needs faster speed.
It just became too slow and boring, everything is taking too long. Average player skill is just enough for the faster speed now.
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If you are referring to native where most NA servers have gamemode set to fastest - this was probably what killed native in north america.
No need to repeat that.
(more ping dependant, less skill dependant, spamming is more useful, etc etc)
100% true.
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Decimo, sorry but what you are saying is pure BS.
If you want a challenge, there is nothing stopping you. Join Ninja i.ex.
Play with a bastard sword in stead of a triple loomed danish (which I just guess you use)
take off some armor, do what you must.
on the other hand, I'm not against starting a high speed duel server (in addition to the one we have). Battle should stay as it is because of ping problems at high game speed.
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There is a problem, some duels can take 5 minutes, some 10 minutes if to play serious and сoncentrated.
1. Prove it. Post 3 YouTube videos of duels that last 5 minutes or longer and one that lasts at least 10 minutes.
2. Use teamwork.
3. If you want a game designed for 1v1 combat, try SF4 or Tekken or something.
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Normal speed is neccessary to keep the playable ping window wide on siege and battle. cRPG is basicly a (strategus) battle server and even when in duel mode it will retain the normal speed so people can test their stuff under normal conditions. If you want faster speeds you can open your own duel server with faster settings.
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Decimo, sorry but what you are saying is pure BS.
If you want a challenge, there is nothing stopping you. Join Ninja i.ex.
Play with a bastard sword in stead of a triple loomed danish (which I just guess you use)
take off some armor, do what you must.
on the other hand, I'm not against starting a high speed duel server (in addition to the one we have). Battle should stay as it is because of ping problems at high game speed.
thomek a higher game speed would really make ninja what they are. FAST.
now even the fastest of your ninjas is not fast enough to not be tracked and being 1hit. and that's what happens everytime i met one. the speed is not enough.
i really enjoyed fighting khorin 9 months ago where fighting a ninja like him WAS a challenge. now is not. ninjas are simply a BIT faster than standard balanced builds. so is not worth the risk to roll a 12/27 light armored ninja if your only upside is speed.
Normal speed is neccessary to keep the playable ping window wide on siege and battle. cRPG is basicly a (strategus) battle server and even when in duel mode it will retain the normal speed so people can test their stuff under normal conditions. If you want faster speeds you can open your own duel server with faster settings.
i agree on the ping part. i just don't get why sieges are slower than battle servers. anyway we have words from chadz and paul. i'm glad you took your time to explain reasons. i'm happy with that.
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I understand what you want, but seriously - we cannot balance the game on the top 2% duelers that might need it. It would fuck the 98% over that have gotten used to this speed and still have trouble blocking feints.
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Bah, thank you chadz, ruining the mod and refusing to fix it.
:lol:
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I understand what you want, but seriously - we cannot balance the game on the top 2% duelers that might need it. It would fuck the 98% over that have gotten used to this speed and still have trouble blocking feints.
So what you basicly trying to say is %2 of community is pretty good at this game but the other %98 is pretty good at whining so they win.This mod is turning more into WoW with every single patch. I asume in the near future we will be having ''3 sec cast time'' for a single sword swing. Just look at Strategus. Battles at 6 am? Reminds of raid times.
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What...
I can't even..
are you really that stupid?
I really think i need a break from cRPG, the retards that feel the urge to voice their "opinion" lately really give me a headache
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All we need is the Chefflon Uanler http://chefflonuanler.weebly.com/
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So what you basicly trying to say is %2 of community is pretty good at this game but the other %98 is pretty good at whining so they win.This mod is turning more into WoW with every single patch. I asume in the near future we will be having ''3 sec cast time'' for a single sword swing. Just look at Strategus. Battles at 6 am? Reminds of raid times.
In this thread its the 2% thats whining :P
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What...
I can't even..
are you really that stupid?
I really think i need a break from cRPG, the retards that feel the urge to voice their "opinion" lately really give me a headache
/clap
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Will somebody PLEASE think of the tripple-loomed elite scimitars? :O They do not need to be any faster.
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No.
Thats my opinion.
Maybe make a seperate test server with faster speed, but thats it.
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So what you basicly trying to say is %2 of community is pretty good at this game but the other %98 is pretty good at whining so they win.This mod is turning more into WoW with every single patch. I asume in the near future we will be having ''3 sec cast time'' for a single sword swing. Just look at Strategus. Battles at 6 am? Reminds of raid times.
.... chadz isn't talking about whiners, he's talking about the general playerbase and you make no sense. You can't cater exclusively to the best players or you'll lose 98% of your playerbase. What chadz says makes sense, but I think cRPG's average skill level is getting high enough to increase the gamespeed a little - 20-30 wpf increase across the board would be swell, IMO.
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Ok now seriously... I don't think the game is too slow right now, can't we just be happy for what we have? Honestly i think there shouldn't be any space for duelers outside duel server, Imo this game is about teamplay and trying to find the best tactic to annihilate player's individual skill(aka ganking).
As Mtemko said, maybe devs should test faster speed on a separate server, it could be a server with low population ,for example Eu4 (btw for what i know Eu4 could be already setted on highest speed )
What we are unconsciosly trying to find is the Chefflon Uanler, the answer to all our problems: THE TRUE TRUTH
http://chefflonuanler.weebly.com/
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Agree on the game becoming a little too slow paced, but it's really not that bad.
Changing the game speed setting is a terrible, terrible idea though : it doesn't look all that much faster, and from my experience screws up the game mechanics quite a bit (weird timing, hits registered slightly before the model actually gets you ...).
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.... chadz isn't talking about whiners, he's talking about the general playerbase and you make no sense. You can't cater exclusively to the best players or you'll lose 98% of your playerbase. What chadz says makes sense, but I think cRPG's average skill level is getting high enough to increase the gamespeed a little - 20-30 wpf increase across the board would be swell, IMO.
Didnt it all start with whiners?Game was fine before all those nerf patches.It was hardcore.You were getting one hitted by pretty much everything and you needed to be on guard at all time because of it.It needed skillz to survive but ''the general playerbase'' eventualy started to whine.And game become slower and easier with every patch. Where you just simply grind to level 31 and get a heilrloom and do it again and again. It even needs like 5 hit to kill a guy now.Eventually it became the new Wow. Even wow pvp is harder than crpg right now. You need to press like 10+ buttons there. Whereas here you just press left click,right click,left click,right click...
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In this thread its the 2% thats whining :P
we're not whining. we just stated some good things. overall skill is increased, the game feel slower than a year ago (where average skill was so low that spamming was rewarding)
i just gave my 2 cents about almost a year playing this mod. every balance patch (good or bad.. mostly good) only nerfd abused weapons instead buffing the weak ones. patch after patch, the nerf tweaks all together, just made clear how fast was the fighting speed in september 2010 and how slow is now.
is not a complain about a weapon category versus another or the never ending war 2h versus polearms, ranged versus non-shielders.
we just stated facts, we had good replies, we had good opinions from chadz and the devs.
the conclusion is satisfacting.
A- we can't raise the overall fighting speed because would raise the gap between low pingers and high pingers, between elitists and casuals.
B- we COULD anyway see some wpf scale improvements. the more and more strength builds or balanced but STR minded builds proves that. because mindless spamming is not anymore a viable choice. the only advantage in taking more agility is just for athletics. after 5 WM, agi is no more worthy. example:
level 30
5WM
main profiency = 148
level 30
6WM
main profiency = 156
level 30
7WM
main profiency = 164
level 30
8WM
main profiency = 173
level 30
9WM
main profiency = 181
as you can see, every weapon master past 5, only raise your main weapon by 8-9 points against a 8% damage increase by powerstrike per point.
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Ok now seriously... I don't think the game is so slow right now, can't we jus be happy for what we have? Honestly i think there shouldn't be any space for duelers outside duel server, Imo this game is about teamplay and trying to find the best tactic to annihilate player's individual skill(aka ganking).
As Mtemko said, maybe devs should test faster speed on a separate server, it could be a server with low population ,for example Eu4 (btw for what i know Eu4 could be already setted on highest speed )
What we are unconsciosly trying to find is the Chefflon Uanler, the answer to all our problems: THE TRUE TRUTH
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lars... your opinion is biased because your computer actually sucks :P and you never saw the old cRPG when the speed was really almost doubled.
when you'll soon change your rig, you'll understand what we're talking about.Didnt it all start with whiners?Game was fine before all those nerf patches.It was hardcore.You were getting one hitted by pretty much everything and you needed to be on guard at all time because of it.It needed skillz to survive but ''the general playerbase'' eventualy started to whine.And game become slower and easier with every patch. Where you just simply grind to level 31 and get a heilrloom and do it again and again. It even needs like 5 hit to kill a guy now.Eventually it became the new Wow. Even wow pvp is harder than crpg right now. You need to press like 10+ buttons there. Whereas here you just press left click,right click,left click,right click...
you're right. at that time, cRPG average skill was not high enough to play with that speed. now things are different. average skill is WAY higher. and a more hardcore game will only make average players grow. but as the average skill grow, the speed nerfs kicks in... that's what i don't really understand. now average manual blockers blocks so good that we'll see just more and more mauls.
and please don't say NERF HAMMERS SPEED without thinking about it a second.
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Well, I'm another one of those "vets" who are here since 2010 summer, or are from around that time.
Got to agree, the game was very, very different back then, the speeds and skills provided a totally different gameplay than our current version, obviously.
The speed was different, a lot. I remember when the devs introduced the poleaxes, I instantly saved up for the Elegant.
(yes, people HAD TO save up back then, you only earned like 200-250 if you were good per round.)
And it had a speed of 97, later 95, then 93, and now, 92. I'll only mention this weapon because It's my most used and trusty weapon in the game, can't really judge other stuff, let alone non-polearm things from personal experience.
To be honest, what I really miss from old times is the feeling of achievement. Granted, you can grind to 31, then get a heirloom, do nice deals at the market, but this feels kinda meh. You can have everything so easily now.
At old cRPG, people were afraid of experimenting, or buying certain weapons because rumors were told that they're bugged.
Anyone remember Gnjus with the Sniper Crossbow? Yeah, things like that.
Also, what I really dislike, is how we modernized in a lazy way. People just.. optimize. Optimize their leveling speed so they reach 30 in a blink of an eye compared to old times, optimize their builds to the last skill point, optimize their gear and equipment to the degree that we'll end up fighting each-others clones, with different sets. At first, it felt like you were given a map, with some basic knowledge of your destination. You had to find out all the mechanics, all the back info, and you had to rely on gossip. It was an adventure.
Today this is replaced with a fully updated GPS screen what can get you to anywhere, in a blink of an eye.
During this one year, the personal skill of the avg. player really increased.
Or is it because there are a lot of 30 people so it became a bit "standardized" compared to older days, where we had level differences?
And granted, people have more fun early, but it just feels a bit dull. No offense, maybe it's only me being tired of the game a little bit, but that's how I feel.
Back on topic: I think that speeding the game up won't give these feelings back, let alone give better gameplay. It'll just end up being a bigger spamfest than ever.
(Some test server for it would be handy, though.)
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Having a high ping has nothing to do with skill.
What you are basically asking for is making the game unplayable for a lot of people that don't have low ping on any or most servers - like, fuck off? No, fuck you.
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Having a high ping has nothing to do with skill.
What you are basically asking for is making the game unplayable for a lot of people that don't have low ping on any or most servers - like, fuck off? No, fuck you.
This.
Additionally, people complain about polestun enough as it is. With faster/fastest, it will become permastun. The game speed is fine as is right now.
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I would want this if I had a better ping :)
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If you are referring to native where most NA servers have gamemode set to fastest - this was probably what killed native in north america.
No need to repeat that.
(more ping dependant, less skill dependant, spamming is more useful, etc etc)
Thank you
recently my internet has been bugging out and I've been stuck at 80-120 ping on NA servers where I would normally get 30-60 the only reason I can still play without simply rage quitting and saying the game is unplayable is because this game isn't lightening fast anymore people with higher pings have a chance to defend themselves against people with 9-30 ping.
I would want this if I had a better ping :)
lol totally agree :P
All you guys saying how skilled it is that you can block super fast lightening striking weapons, that's great, you have thoroughly impressed me..
Just gotta say this again so it's even more obvious
I would want this if I had a better ping :)
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average skill is WAY higher. a
Just to elaborate on this.. it's actually pretty weird how much the average skill has improved. Now there are a LOT of pretty good players that you need to do something "special" against to hit - chamber etc. 6 months or so ago most people had problems with a simple feint or two.
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Ping has nothing to do with it. Take archery for example. If you have high ping you have to shoot infront of the guy to actually shoot him. So what about the archers with high ping why dont we nerf something to let them play too? But what can we do? Hmm....Oh i know! Lets nerf Ath so even the archers with high ping will be able to shoot easily.... but whatever if you really think its fine as it is then its fine.
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Ping has nothing to do with it. Take archery for example. If you have high ping you have to shoot infront of the guy to actually shoot him. So what about the archers with high ping why dont we nerf something to let them play too? But what can we do? Hmm....Oh i know! Lets nerf Ath so even the archers with high ping will be able to shoot easily.... but whatever if you really think its fine as it is then its fine.
words can not describe how much of an idiot you are.
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Having a high ping has nothing to do with skill.
What you are basically asking for is making the game unplayable for a lot of people that don't have low ping on any or most servers - like, fuck off? No, fuck you.
so back in 2010 cRPG was unplayable? no. i had 80-110 ping at that time, a rig barely able to keep 40fps in a big strat battle.
instead babbling fuck here and fuck there, just think.
words can not describe how much of an idiot you are.
said the genius that enlightened us about this discussion.
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In the end, chadz said no because he has this strange opinion that we should cater to average player skill and not the top elite...
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Yeah, it was nearing that. Certain builds, certain players with certain weapons i couldn't possibly block, their attacks just passing through my blocks always. Nothing about skill, fairness or fun there.
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People with 80+ ping should perhaps consider if they're playing the right game. A twitch-based game where 'skill' equals your reacation time. :rolleyes:
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People that think that their fun is more important than that of others should perhaps consider not playing at all for a while. :rolleyes:
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Ya, I dunno though. You can go watch people duel in the strategus duel server, it's so slowwwwwwwwww compared to native. Used to be comparable, if not faster.
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In the end, chadz said no because he has this strange opinion that we should cater to average player skill and not the top elite...
In the end, chadz said no because he has normal opinion that he do the mod for himself (and he can't block for shit even on slow, so it's obvious he dont want fastest).
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isn't there a FAST game speed? Something between the medium we have now and Fastest?
Why not do a test run on that speed for a bit. I mean, IT IS a beta. Why not test a different speed and see if that speed hurts what's been done, or helps it. If it's not efficient then roll back to medium.
If you DO do a speed increase, don't tell anyone until afterwords. That way the complaints won't be premeditated. A lot of people complain that faster game will increase spam, so if stated ahead of time, then the spam complaints WILL increase. If not, then the likelihood of them increasing is minimal for the first day or two.
TL;DR
Ninja increase game speed to fast(if it's there, not fastest), test it for a few days and see the results.
I bring this back up since people don't like to listen to the guy with a compromise made up. :( Just try fast(NOT FASTEST) and see how it goes. Revert back and then ask for opinions. Test, Acquire data, Post Data, Make decision. All this Back then that and ping this doesn't help. Test it and let the FACTS state what should be done. (Though I'm of the opinion that fast might be just right, medium though might be best. I'd love to test it and see how it goes. Lets use the NA community for it, since EU gets everything else tested ;p)
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As Thomek has said, if you're starting to find the game too easy there's many ways to gimp yourself.
Take off the armour. Use a short/unbalanced weapon. Play an archer with 50 one hand wpf. If anything, you'll get a greater sense of accomplishment if you do manage to kill something.
If you're not willing to do that, then you're probably not measuring skill in terms of actual skill, but in kills.
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As Thomek has said, if you're starting to find the game too easy there's many ways to gimp yourself.
Take off the armour. Use a short/unbalanced weapon. Play an archer with 50 one hand wpf. If anything, you'll get a greater sense of accomplishment if you do manage to kill something.
If you're not willing to do that, then you're probably not measuring skill in terms of actual skill, but in kills.
there is a big difference between easy and slow. mind it.
so what we all have to do is running naked with a torch trying to topping the scoreboards? uh whatever.
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It takes an average of only a few seconds for me to kill my opponent in melee on the battlefield, or be killed... I don't see this as needing to be faster. Rare are any fights that last longer then ten seconds.
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It takes an average of only a few seconds for me to kill my opponent in melee on the battlefield, or be killed... I don't see this as needing to be faster. Rare are any fights that last longer then ten seconds.
^
This.
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It takes an average of only a few seconds for me to kill my opponent in melee on the battlefield, or be killed... I don't see this as needing to be faster. Rare are any fights that last longer then ten seconds.
try EU servers sometime. :rolleyes:
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try EU servers sometime. :rolleyes:
He is NA.
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try EU servers sometime. :rolleyes:
About 25% of my playing time is on EU_1 or EU_2 or EU_4 due to running with friends over there or with the Fallen. I suppose I am missing all of the good long fights then. *shrugs* Maybe it is due to the hours I play as I can only play evenings/late-night/early-mornings times for the EU timezones due to where I live.
Since you play there all the time and presumably during normal hours, I will take your word on this.
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If we want this mod to grow, I suggest we keep the speed on medium. This game already has a steep learning curve as it is. New players have more of a chance of rage quitting permanently, if we speed up the game. I think it is best to keep the speed where it is for the longevity and "lastabilty" of the mod. For those who think fights last to long, learn some more complex feinting.
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...hmm, I've changed my mind slightly, while I'm still not into raising gamespeed, wpf could use some tweaking I agree.
Athletics buff aswell?
Or just a plain, across-the-board weapon-speed buff? (tho I would prefer wpf boost, agi needs something)
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Any increase to melee speed will be in favor for those who have better pings. A lot of good melee players also have a good ping (under 50).
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Any increase to melee speed will be in favor for those who have better pings. A lot of good melee players also have a good ping (under 50).
whats the difference between speeding up the game and increasing weapon speed? either way both will depend on ping.
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Game is fast already. Give an old man a break, my reflexes are not what they used to be. :D
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whats the difference between speeding up the game and increasing weapon speed? either way both will depend on ping.
Well, this was my point really, there is no difference. Any speed change will result in battles being more ping dependant.
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I think if anything gets sped up, it should be the bonus speed from athletics. AGI needs SOMETHING decent to balance against the STR stat. High AGI/ATH characters really should have faster footwork as their defense rather than the HP you get as a str build.
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I think if anything gets sped up, it should be the bonus speed from athletics. AGI needs SOMETHING decent to balance against the STR stat. High AGI/ATH characters really should have faster footwork as their defense rather than the HP you get as a str build.
yes. athletics should be buffed and heavier armors should then weight more to balance the changes. buffing athletics without making plate heavier, will only make plate/transitionals 18/21 builds too much fast running.
EDIT:
and by the way, im a balanced 21/18 so i'm speaking against me. :?
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People with 80+ ping should perhaps consider if they're playing the right game. A twitch-based game where 'skill' equals your reacation time. :rolleyes:
i played the old crpg with 130-150 ping for months and killed many many ppl....Was hard but its not that bad :)
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whats the difference between speeding up the game and increasing weapon speed? either way both will depend on ping.
Very wrong, speeding the game will speed up everything, so worse hit detection, more spamming etc etc and will make ppl with high pings dont have a chance. WPF actually helps to high pingers, since in the end, more wpf feels exactly like lower ping (when attacking, that is)... That is why i actually played the old crpg with high agi to compensate my ping, and while i needed 2 or 3 hits more it was worth and could kill anyone having 130 ping.....
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I get enough outspammed because of my shitty connection already. I, for one, don't want it to be faster.
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It takes an average of only a few seconds for me to kill my opponent in melee on the battlefield, or be killed... I don't see this as needing to be faster. Rare are any fights that last longer then ten seconds.
I disagree with this, I come across plenty of opponents that I can't hit easily and who can't hit me easily, and I'm not even that good a blocker. A lot of fights just go on until a second player arrives on the scene.
The reason that cRPG became so slow is that strength is now the attribute of choice. 36 str builds are viable these days, I believe 36 str players do really good in battle. Try that with 36 or 33 agi or even 27 agi. You can't even use a proper weapon. Am I the only one who thinks that is very weird. 36 str should be a gimmick character, just like 36 agi. Agility is hugely inferior to strength, and that should be changed.
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I disagree with this, I come across plenty of opponents that I can't hit easily and who can't hit me easily, and I'm not even that good a blocker. A lot of fights just go on until a second player arrives on the scene.
The reason that cRPG became so slow is that strength is now the attribute of choice. 36 str builds are viable these days, I believe 36 str players do really good in battle. Try that with 36 or 33 agi or even 27 agi. You can't even use a proper weapon. Am I the only one who thinks that is very weird. 36 str should be a gimmick character, just like 36 agi. Agility is hugely inferior to strength, and that should be changed.
totally agree.
the reason that cRPG became so slow is that WPF cost is high and when you reach 150 profiency, strength is way more valuable in terms of efficiency. As the majority people states, the only reason to pump agility a bit is for ATH and agility running speed bonus itself.
i also did some good str builds in the past but i still need 5-6 ATH to chase runners and footwork essential for how i like to play.
the fact that EU player builds tends towards balanced or slightly agi biased, is only because are effective in duels. in USA strength builds seems to be the bigger part because they didn't have a duel server until USA strat came back.
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basically agree with darkfox.<
if you just dont be so scared to try an feint learn an feint do ur parkinson feint.
u wil actualy notice this makes it was faster, gets me more kills, but at the same time i sometimes just make an fail and u get killed but this is way more fun and most of the times more effective.
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this is a combat simulation, not some timelapse jump-and-run kiddo shooter...
Skill and tactics, not merely ping and reflexes...
-1
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this is a combat simulation, not some timelapse jump-and-run kiddo shooter...
Skill and tactics, not merely ping and reflexes...
-1
Your mother is a combat simulator
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this is a combat simulation, not some timelapse jump-and-run kiddo shooter...
Skill and tactics, not merely ping and reflexes...
-1
this is a medieval war game with multiplayer capabilities... not a third age turn-based civilization VI, not even a medieval themed ArmA2 or Operation Flashpoint.
reflexes and reaction times play the bigger fighting part. that's why is so much ping dependant (more than a shooter... because in a shooter you just need to do is adding lag prediction to shots. here having 20 ping or 80 makes a big difference between to hit and being hit.)
then positioning skill (footwork) and team tactics.
if you make a team with superb field tactics but poor individual skills versus a team with poor field tactics but above average individual skills, the second team will still win. they will just need to stick together.
also see that the most skilled warband players usually pings between 30 and 50. there is nothing to do with it. low ping gives much more room for mistakes. and on par, the ping should remain stable. once you get used to a delay (ping) you react and use it accordingly. that's why is better a fixed 70 ping than a 30-60 variable ping.
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reflexes and reaction times play the bigger fighting part. that's why is so much ping dependant (more than a shooter... because in a shooter you just need to do is adding lag prediction to shots. here having 20 ping or 80 makes a big difference between to hit and being hit.)
also see that the most skilled warband players usually pings between 30 and 50. there is nothing to do with it. low ping gives much more room for mistakes.
Considering the average player has well over 50 ping...
You just made an arguement on why the game should not be even faster. Increasing game speed would only futher prove the point that this game "is so much ping dependant" so why make it worse?
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Considering the average player has well over 50 ping...
You just made an arguement on why the game should not be even faster. Increasing game speed would only futher prove the point that this game "is so much ping dependant" so why make it worse?
well after taking ping into the context (as i badly forgot) i just agree that we don't need the game to be set on FAST. but i still agree on some wpf calculation improvements to counter STR biased builds and making AGI a bit more useful than for running (footwork) purpose.
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Prejanuary 27/27 build was fun.
The game felt about right on all the normal servers back then.
Duel could last as long as it does now, just needed players on a same skilllevel, not neceserilly charlvl.
It was the most thrilling, exhausting and demanding period of crpg.
Note-I said that december last year-:
Regardless of what happens to game balance etc., it will be the same players toping the scoreboards.
I was right, who was bad/ok/great stayed bad/ok/great.
Its not valid to mix a slower, easier balance with a general (automatically developing) better playerbase.
Ppl. who worked on their skill would ve gotten better anyways...regardless of the speed the game has.
CRPG sure still is great, but, the more casual it gets, the more it looses his unique WOW OHMAGAD moments.
Its all about the constant swingspeed nerfs in my opinion, not thaaat much about the wpp.
I' d welcome some faster swingspeeds, a little better wpp developement too :-).
And please, arguements about a learning curve?
Every tried going for a real simulator?
U d laugh about this so called learning curve in CRPG.
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WOW OHMAGAD moments.
I want more of those!
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Your mother is a combat simulator
You are a shining example for those in need of MOAR speed...
Suggestion: set one (battle) server to high speed, so the low-ping, epeeeeeeeeen carrying fast lovers who always finish too quickly can make out there.
And the rest of us can have fun on the other servers because it is good as it is.
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cRPG_EU7_FASTEST_2H_ONLY
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cRPG_EU7_FASTEST_2H_ONLY
CMPX, we have a melee only server (Tunatown) for the North American community. Can we have that set to the fastest speed as well??
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Why do you ask me? It's your server, of course you can...
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You are a shining example for those in need of MOAR speed...
Suggestion: set one (battle) server to high speed, so the low-ping, epeeeeeeeeen carrying fast lovers who always finish too quickly can make out there.
And the rest of us can have fun on the other servers because it is good as it is.
Oh yeah? Your FACE is a shining example.
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cRPG_EU7_FASTEST_2H_ONLY
i'll test it as soon as i can. :oops:
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cRPG_EU7_FASTEST_2H_ONLY
How about, 100% polestun active, polearm only server. With only 2 weapons active, long spear and pike!
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How about, 100% polestun active, polearm only server. With only 2 weapons active, long spear and pike!
Baww, too fast for siiem? :(
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How about, 100% polestun active, polearm only server. With only 2 weapons active, long spear and pike!
with a faster game speed, stun should durate less as ALL the game mechanics are faster. so the stun will be (faster=shorter)
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Why not ban all the people from weird eastern European countries with more then average 70 ping. Seems like the perfect plan.
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Why not ban all the people from weird eastern European countries with more then average 70 ping. Seems like the perfect plan.
you know what's the funny thing? russians ping 50ms on eu servers. like i do. but i ping 100ms on russian server while russians ping 4ms, 7ms, 10ms... the worst ping of a russian in the russian server is like 14ms.
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you know what's the funny thing? russians ping 50ms on eu servers. like i do. but i ping 100ms on russian server while russians ping 4ms, 7ms, 10ms... the worst ping of a russian in the russian server is like 14ms.
Bad routing I guess.
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Bad routing I guess.
no... retarded italian nineties DSL lines while the rest of the world use fiber cable. in italy we share the same technology as zimbabwe, congo, nigeria...
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cRPG_EU7_FASTEST_2H_ONLY
i tried it but is set on MEDIUM.
i'll periodically check it. thanks.
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I completely disagree.
No player I've met has had a defence that cannot be broken through, and while there has been some really long duels, I cannot say I haven't enjoyed them.
*cough* Urist *cough*
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*cough* Urist *cough*
OVERRATED
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I have to agree, after all the nerfs, nerfs and more nerfs it looks like the game is catered to old men with the reaction time of a sloth. Speeding it up slightly would make it more entertaining.
Yes
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It's funny how this was an issue in mid 2011 already. The mod has continued becoming slower and clunkier constantly. Just going back to native you could feed a massive difference in speed.
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2011 it felt slow, and then we had like 5 more years of nerfs :lol: