[STATS] Scythe

[HarunYahya]

Probably dumbest person on these forums, and doesn't even know it.

Please do everyone a favour and stop trying to argument with your pseudo-factual opinions.

Lol i love the irony here Bjord calling someone dumb.
Truth hurts , don't make idiotic suggestions cuz of your butthurt.
Seriously -8 damage + unbalanced ? lol...

[Xant]

The poll should be about whether or not scythe needs a nerf, not "do you agree with the proposed stats".. I think the proposed stats are too big of a nerf, but I think it's too cheap for what it does.

[Vibe]

The poll should be about whether or not scythe needs a nerf, not "do you agree with the proposed stats".. I think the proposed stats are too big of a nerf, but I think it's too cheap for what it does.

I agree. I believe I might have overnerfed it a bit too much. Still, Scythe most definitely needs a nerf.
Well, this thread is for discussion, I wouldn't mind any of you posting how they would nerf Scythe or why they wouldn't nerf it.

[Bjord]

Lol i love the irony here Bjord calling someone dumb.
Truth hurts , don't make idiotic suggestions cuz of your butthurt.
Seriously -8 damage + unbalanced ? lol...

My god, do you just realize the irony of the irony of the post that you claim is ironic? IRONIC.

And last time I checked, you're a nobody, so... I'm calling you dumb, it's is justified. 

Besides, I never saw you make a sensible argument. At least I try once in a while(witnesses appreciated). I can agree that Vibe's suggestions for nerfing were a bit zealous, but that does not disregard the whole idea of nerfing it at all. It is the longest polearm with all directions, and it is ridiculously powerful for its cost. It does way too much damage for an alleged peasant weapon.

Now please give me some good reasons, Koyama, why it should not be nerfed? If you think you're so clever, let's see you walk the walk. You sure like to talk, that's for sure. Especially for someone whose IQ is not very evident. But I'm sure I've got you all wrong, you're probably the smartest guy on these forums. It's just that you don't want to show off, right? Something like that, I'm sure.

[Vibe]

Changed the nerf a bit, new nerf:

Proposed weapon stats:
weight: 2.3 (-0.7)
speed rating: 86
weapon length: 182
thrust damage: 14 pierce
swing damage: 23 cut (-5)
slots: 2
Can't sheath
Can't use on horseback
Cost: 1200

Removed unbalanced, buffed by 3 cut, weight +0.3, price increased.

[Zisa]

failing to see how this is worse then a bunch of pikers.
Also, it is not particularily a threat in battle, hate to see something fucked due to strategus.

[Lizard_man]

Just been up against this weapon in strat, pretty much 1 hitting me and my shield...

[Vibe]

Yep, like I said.. many scythe users in Druzhina strat battle.. not that I blame them for using this weapon. Those who were at the battle now know.

[Deathwhisper]

I agree. I believe I might have overnerfed it a bit too much. Still, Scythe most definitely needs a nerf.
Well, this thread is for discussion, I wouldn't mind any of you posting how they would nerf Scythe or why they wouldn't nerf it.

A nerf to it's stats isn't a good solution imo. It only deals a lot of damage with a STR build and on low armor targets. 28 is already very low. A cost increase to something like 1k5 would already be enough to limit it on the battlefield. It's still got counters amongst low cost weapons like the staff (103 speed) and you're forced to use overheads only if teammates are near you (side swings will most likely TK and thrust is useless except to stop horses). Nerfing it into oblivion (yes, 1k2 cost and 23 cut would make it useless for any non peasant) would reduce the low cost weapon variety even further and you'd probably see everyone using staves (only 300 gold) until it's nerfed to 14b and 98 speed.
You won't fix low level strategus by nerfing the most used weapons, but by adding more low tier weapons and increasing variety. Scythe is already far behind the flamberge or the english bill on siege or battle in terms of effectiveness anyway, so it's only a strategus issue.

[Oberyn]

introduce new weapon called peasant scythe with crappy stats and gold cost of the scythe now, increase cost of scythe.

[Deathwhisper]

introduce new weapon called peasant scythe with crappy stats and gold cost of the scythe now, increase cost of scythe.

That's actually a good and constructive suggestion, it fixes the weapon in strat while keeping it viable in regular battles or siege where it's currently fine.

[PhantomZero]

I bet if people used Pitchforks often enough in strategus someone would claim they are OP.

[Snoozer]

That's actually a good and constructive suggestion, it fixes the weapon in strat while keeping it viable in regular battles or siege where it's currently fine.

hmm fine i suppose

but is it just me or is the a nerf cycle going on?to me th eonly reason this weapon is so good is because the weapons that were once better and superior then it got nerfed.

or am i crazy? the only buff i can think of in recent past was the buff to archers by making damage based off of arrows and throwings unnerf that  before thier damage against armor made them completely useless to the point u were a throw troll(pure throw build....lets be honest how many NON trolls throwers have you seen?) and you still sucked ass,now its far more lethal and effective

oh wait i misinterpreted vibe so back to topic

Changed the nerf a bit, new nerf:

Proposed weapon stats:
weight: 2.3 (-0.7)
speed rating: 86
weapon length: 182
thrust damage: 14 pierce
swing damage: 23 cut (-5)
slots: 2
Can't sheath
Can't use on horseback
Cost: 1200

Removed unbalanced, buffed by 3 cut, weight +0.3, price increased.

so your asking to only raise the first purchase of the weapon? or also raise upkeep as well?

p.s i think -5 dam is rather massive

[TucKMuncK]

too radical. I would say make it unbalanced and take 1-3 dmg away

[Jarlek]

The scythe is the best peasant weapon. I actually like that. It makes sense and gives everyone a weapon they can use in the beginning rounds of strat. Because of it's great length it is still usable by non-polearms.

As other people mentions, there are also many other good non-polearms that the scythe can be compared too. The scythe only wins over them in length but loses heavily in speed. It's in the speed range of the mauls, maces and slower axes.

But one thing that nobody has pointed out and which for me balances it out a great deal, is the fact that it is unsheathable. It might be the best peasant weapon (peasants ARE armed with scythes, and torches. Need to buff the torch!) and can be decently be used by non-peasants. But, since you will drop it the moment you pickup another weapon/a weapon of your type, it becomes useless unless you put that weapon on your back. This makes sense to me and balances it (in strat) a great ammount to me.

I am not saying it isn't the king of the peasant war, only that it still will be much less effective against higher equipment than it's other friends. 28 cut is bad against armour, the speed is too low and the length is always an issue in group fights and ganks, something peasants heavily depend on to fight real troops. The Two Handed Axe, Battle Axe, Falchion, Spiked Club and Voulge; it's price brethren are in my eyes all slightly more usefull against hier tier equipment than the scythe. The scythe wins at low gear, but loses much more efficiency than the others the better the oponents equipment gets.