cRPG
cRPG => General Discussion => Topic started by: Mamachew on January 18, 2011, 09:41:03 pm
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Look, I'm starting to get tired of seeing all these Nerf/Buff posts.
Yes, your class now sucks.
Yes, everyone else's class now sucks.
Deal with it. Figure it out.
Everyone without shields hates the archers. Archers think they need some buffs. Crossbows think they need to be able to 1 hit people through shields. 2 handers think they need to be faster spammers than 1 handers. Cavalry think their horses need to cost less.
I'll let you all in on a little secret each class is designed to have perks and drawbacks. End o story.
2 handers... you don't have a shield? Too bad you're in the open.
Throwing inaccurate? Good thing you can 1 hit people.
Cav die to quick? Too bad you're trying to run down archers and peasants with pole arms.
Steps to building a character and playing cRPG:
1) choose what you like; weigh pros and cons and stick with it
2) don't complain; yes you do die from time to time.
3) play game
4) have fun
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True, True. I did this kind of post a while back, noone hardly listens. (They dont want to be proven wrong) So good luck with this one.
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Everything good, but are you archer? Try to shoot someone, when you hardly get your bow. yea, its hard, isnt it? And im not talking about dmg, cause it is normal, but shot speed... can you watch some videos of archers competition? Please, do that, then come back.
How fast arrow got to target? Did archer had to aim in sky to shot at target 25m from him?
What are your feelings?
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I am an archer, and yes it sucks. But just learn how to shoot again... Figure out what doesn't work, and don't do that. Everyone thinks someone else needs a nerf and they need a buff.
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Yes, every play style is supposed to have pros and cons. Balance is when every class has pros and cons of equal gravity to every other class. Yes, there is a rock/paper/scissors element to class balance, and this is fine.
People complain because they believe that one class or another is too underpowered or overpowered to participate in that game of rock/paper/scissors. When rock is smashing through paper or scissors are lightsabers, you have a balance issue and imbalanced games are not fun.
The huge forum debates erupt when people disagree about these issues. So long as the participants in these debates are mature and honest about it, they are a good thing. They help to determine if scissors really are lightsabers, and need to be toned down. No, not everyone is mature or honest, but this is no reason to discourage debate or ignore balance issues.
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All should be done same as the native single player..with the experience related to this kind.
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agree. But still xbows sux the most from all ranged now and I feel unloved cose of that, but yeah I do agree to wht ur saying.
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True, True. I did this kind of post a while back, noone hardly listens. (They dont want to be proven wrong) So good luck with this one.
its not about being proven wrong its more about "hey im using a shield as 2h and so are 1 handers but look we're still dying in our hundreds to the apparently "under powered" support class that is archery
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its not about being proven wrong its more about "hey im using a shield as 2h and so are 1 handers but look we're still dying in our hundreds to the apparently "under powered" support class that is archery
This man has a good point.
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Hey forget agincourt I just watched Rambo and lord of the rings and I think we need to change the animation so you can fire two shots at once and where are my explosive arrows?
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and where are my explosive arrows?
Oh don't get me started on those. I've been wanting flaming arrows for a long time now, something to use firebombs for (specialty arrows).
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Balance is when every class has pros and cons of equal gravity to every other class.
The last part is incorrect, FYI.
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its not about being proven wrong its more about "hey im using a shield as 2h and so are 1 handers but look we're still dying in our hundreds to the apparently "under powered" support class that is archery
Woot Support Class?I dont wana Play a Support Class and how becomes only the Archer is 1 of this"Support Classes"!
I just wana make Kills with my "Support Class" like an Archer would do it in Real Live!
Its not like i like to be an OverPowered Archer but degenerate him to an "Support Class" ho can only Hurt People a bit or need 20 Arrows to hit someone or Team Damage (when he shoots into an Meele Fight to support someone) because the Arrow is way to slow in not in my mind!
I think somewhere out there is a Middleway!
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2 handers... you don't have a shield? Too bad you're in the open
This is generally why 2handers want to be able to spam. No shield for auto blocking like a shield which makes feinting to draw an attack so you can parry and swing while they're recovering way harder. Old Balbaroth was a hard lesson in learning to block until you died because his shield came up so quickly and he swung as fast/faster than you.
Not saying it should be like that, but it's a legitimate point as parrying or chambering is much harder than just rmb.
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Throwing is not inaccurate if you put enough wpf in it and even if it was it should not 1shot armored str characters. So no, not everything is fine, this is just what people say when they know their class is OP and about to get nerfed.
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This is generally why 2handers want to be able to spam. No shield for auto blocking like a shield which makes feinting to draw an attack so you can parry and swing while they're recovering way harder. Old Balbaroth was a hard lesson in learning to block until you died because his shield came up so quickly and he swung as fast/faster than you.
Not saying it should be like that, but it's a legitimate point as parrying or chambering is much harder than just rmb.
i dont swing that fast with 162 , actually next retirement ill be 12 agi rest str build, i prefer to hit once and kill than having 20 moar wpf in 1h which is about barely nothing in terms of speed, i wish wpf hard cap would actually start at 200, if you get more than 150 in a weapon , the returns are so diminished your way better with more PS and str
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i dont swing that fast with 162 , actually next retirement ill be 12 agi rest str build, i prefer to hit once and kill than having 20 moar wpf in 1h which is about barely nothing in terms of speed, i wish wpf hard cap would actually start at 200, if you get more than 150 in a weapon , the returns are so diminished your way better with more PS and str
200 is where problems were before. 150 is a nice hard cap, keeps everyone in the realm of sanity as far as their attack speeds. It's not like you're really having a hard time being faster than 90% of the player-base and you're running more str than agi now right? *wink wink*
In all honesty, as a friend, you still swing pretty damned fast given your focus on 1h prof and choice of weapon. If you swapped to say a side sword or Nuiweidao (spwtf?) you would probably be just as fast as pre-patch in relation to everyone else. You're better this way, more capable of being killed which is good, keeps you on your toes more.
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You're right, throwers like you do need to be nerfed :D
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You're right, throwers like you do need to be nerfed :D
Who are you talking about?
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Who are you talking about?
Durzo_Blint. I think that's the thrower that hangs with Cyranule.
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DurzoBlitz.
Ah
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You're right, throwers like you do need to be nerfed :D
lets all be patient , i can smell a nerf in throwing brewing around :D and gorath , its not about me being already fast at 162, its about minimizing the value of agi compared to str , as of now str is way more useful ,
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Good thing you're able to read. I had clearly stated that I was an archer... so try again?
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Good thing you're able to read. I had clearly stated that I was an archer... so try again?
I didn't read your post. Aren't you the person that goes around with Cyranule throwing and killing a bunch of people with him? o.0
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again. Archer... not thrower.
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again. Archer... not thrower.
Oh, then I probably got you mistaken with DurzoBlitz. Sorry :/ I thought I just got the name wrong when I was telling Gorath.
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again. Archer... not thrower.
im scared of your avatar chew :shock:
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lets all be patient , i can smell a nerf in throwing brewing around :D
Probably. :)
and gorath , its not about me being already fast at 162, its about minimizing the value of agi compared to str , as of now str is way more useful ,
Well yeah I can understand that point of view. For me it's still a toss-up, but that's because I need athletics. However it really just doesn't seem like it's worth it, you're right. Noobie_ATS caught up to my tribal warrior wearing 7 athletics character today while he was wearing churburg (basically plated out) and wielding a huscarl. In my mind that's a bit fucked up as all things considered, logically I should have been able to outrun him while I was regrouping to my team (I was being chased by him and 4 of his teammates, lol).
If weight affected movement speed more, and shield skill actually gave more of a tangible effect to shield recovery speed and such then AGI vs STR might be more of a toss-up again (most shielders I know have agreed that shield skill just isn't worth pumping beyond the requirement anymore, and I really have to agree, even though I blasted mine to max again like pre-patch :()
But yeah, currently you're right. Str is a far better investment currently than agi unless you really really need the WM levels to hybrid effectively.
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I've made an archer and I don't find it hard. I've played a two-hander and I don't find it hard. I've made a shielder and I don't find it hard. I've made a horse lancer... again, don't find it hard. I think less time bitching, and more time figuring out what works would get everyone a lot farther.
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Woot Support Class?I dont wana Play a Support Class and how becomes only the Archer is 1 of this"Support Classes"!
I just wana make Kills with my "Support Class" like an Archer would do it in Real Live!
Its not like i like to be an OverPowered Archer but degenerate him to an "Support Class" ho can only Hurt People a bit or need 20 Arrows to hit someone or Team Damage (when he shoots into an Meele Fight to support someone) because the Arrow is way to slow in not in my mind!
I think somewhere out there is a Middleway!
i used the term "support class" as i've seen it used in archer threads (im pretty sure by some archers themselves - they say that archers dont top kill boards - they do - and they dont get a lot of kills hence they are support but still need the same damage as they do now)
i really dont wanna kill every archers fun bcos i know how it would suck for me if my favourite styles were unplayable or melee became less fun
it's just that after the 2.0 patch i felt like armour was actually useful vs arrows (not bolts and throwing items - im cool with that) and I used a 0 req shield to take 1-2 hits before i enaged in melee
what i hate is having to switch to a board shield every single time i'm disengaged from melee because i know some painful arrows will be incoming soon
it's silly to see some 2h switching back and forth between 2h and shield like some crazed maniac who cant decide whether he wants to fight or turtle
it feels silly to play like that too
heavy armour reduces speed/wpf - that's cool and i build my 2h based on those facts and to counter them
i dont wanna do an agi build and swing faster than every other mofo - i like to get as close to 1 hit kills with a 2 handed sword as i can and i base my build on that too
what i want is for this heavy armour to actually protect me from some f***ing arrows and not to die in 2 chest shots with 50+ body armour bcos i cant fight as a 2h if i have my back to a wall with my shield up cowering like some fool
switching to gothic and expensive gloves doesnt help too much either
i dont mind it so much any more bcos im used to it pre 2.0 but it was nice for a while
archer damage should reflect the fact that 60+ body armour is few and far between now
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i dont swing that fast with 162 , actually next retirement ill be 12 agi rest str build, i prefer to hit once and kill than having 20 moar wpf in 1h which is about barely nothing in terms of speed, i wish wpf hard cap would actually start at 200, if you get more than 150 in a weapon , the returns are so diminished your way better with more PS and str
With light armour, it's not bad. I prefer it in battle to an agility build. Especially with a steel pick.
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The last part is incorrect, FYI.
Care to explain? Are you saying that some classes should be inherently better than others? If every class has advantages that are coupled with equal disadvantages except for one or two, then that is imbalanced and not fun for anyone not playing those classes.
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well as proven in this post the main problem is not the balancing but people who did not try every class but still claim knowledge about them because they get killed by it...
it's never the whines balancing should listen to but the overall amount of it from each class to see if they are well balanced.
right now everything seams pretty fine as there is an equal amount of whining on all sides :mrgreen:
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I haven't seen any thrower whining ;)
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I haven't seen any thrower whining ;)
Well, throwing is bullshit, 1 km wide accuracy, only sometimes 50/50 1 hit people with 10 pt 100wpf , full str char with no chance against other classes in melee, cav rapes you because you arent fast enough or accurate enough to kill them before you get a lance in your face, archers raping you, only effective 1 hit wep throwing lances. There is some whine for you, you asked for it .
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Well, throwing is bullshit, 1 km wide accuracy, only sometimes 50/50 1 hit people with 10 pt 100wpf , full str char with no chance against other classes in melee, cav rapes you because you arent fast enough or accurate enough to kill them before you get a lance in your face, archers raping you, only effective 1 hit wep throwing lances. There is some whine for you, you asked for it .
I really feel better now thanks :)
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Woot Support Class?I dont wana Play a Support Class and how becomes only the Archer is 1 of this"Support Classes"!
I just wana make Kills with my "Support Class" like an Archer would do it in Real Live!
Archery through history:
- stay in line with your comrades
- wait for commanders call to fire
- fire only when other archers fire and aim the same target
What you think archery is:
- legolas
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Balance is where the class i play the most is really good and all the other classes are much weaker.